Can we please stop repeating the “You have to eat at a deficit to lose weight on KETO” lie?

(Susan) #531

I always ate everything, but my brother was a fussy eater -I have horrible, vivid images in my head still of my dad jamming food down his throat -forcing him to eat everything -not a good image at all. I made a conscious effort to put less food on my kid’s plates and telling them they could have more if they wanted afterwards because of this…

(Jack Bennett) #532

All that weird, pseudo-psychological diet advice never made sense to me. “Oh wow, I didn’t notice that I ate a half-size portion because I ate the whole bowl … and there’s no chance I’ll ever go for a second helping.” (sarcasm)

Seems more like academic / clinical wishful thinking than anything that actually gets results.

(Scott) #533

Just now thinking about it. I never go back for seconds anymore even if she says eat up cause I am going to have to throw it out. I am a once and done eater now. NSV I guess.

(Susan) #534

That is terrific, Scott. Maybe your lovely wife should cook a bit less now? I have had to do this! When I was feeding hubby, our 5 kids and myself, I needed more food -now that our two boys are not living here and our three girls are almost 19, 21, 25 (she just bought a house with her bf of 10 years and moving out after they are done their renovations) and my little 3 year old grand daughter, I have to keep reminding myself to cook way less. This is due to them liking to cook a lot of stuff on their own, and me being Keto as well. Our boys always ate a lot, hehe.

#535

It does work for some people, according to them. I can imagine someone overeats ONLY because they have something on their plate left. Or stop eating and stay hungry but lose weight when their tiny plate is cleared…
It’s just a stupid idea for me who eats for satiation and nutrition (and other things, I don’t consider food as fuel only but I usually get enough joy from my nutritious food my body needs anyway).

But the plate and size thing is annoyingly common. One one plate of food! As much protein as your hand or whatever. I saw “1 inch high side dish on half of your plate” too. Or 200g food! No matter what, just 200g. What does it have to do with anything? My body has needs. And guess what, egg whites aren’t the same as sausages despite both have protein.
I usually can’t do anything with the words “portion” or “serving”. The right portion is what I need at the moment, I guess. Maybe it’s 10 times as much as some other people’s ideal portion, I can’t help that. “Portion people” act like we are all the same, with the same goals and needs, using the same food choices and the same number of meals a day. It’s very odd to me.

(hottie turned hag) #536

I’ve been reading this thread when new posts pop up because I recently am experiencing a reduce cals experiment resulting in losses, thing myself.

Condensed version:
started keto Aug 2017 never counted cals nor macros but ate high fat/no carbs except in veg/whatev protein but always meat heavy and MUCH CHEESE and lost swiftly and steadily until I got to 122 lb then stalled.

Went almost-carn got to 115. Had to eliminate cheese which prior to that time had been a big staple, as in 1lb/DAY -while losing 60+lb- to do it.

Stalled. AGAIN fml. :expressionless:

I figured out it was because for my very small size and sedentariness I was eating too much. Too much fat, too much period.

I reintro-ed apples, cabbage, sweet potatoes and CarbMaster yogurt in controlled amounts and am now visibly thinner :smiley:
At my size losses/gains (have had no gains though since starting, just stalls) are obvious. My ribcage is more visible, ditto clavicle and face is thinner, and lower abd flatter.

Now I don’t think eating more carbs than I was, is why.
I think it’s because by so doing I am eating far less, generally.

I don’t own a scale and weigh only at a certain grocer’s and will do so in a few weeks and report back if good results but the visuals so far are sweet.

This must have to do with me being so close to goal and such low fat percentage (though I am flabby as hell) because when I was fat the old way worked fantastic.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #537

Think of it as a moment to pause and reflect, maybe you’ll realize that you’ve had enough. Loading the plate to the max causes many to have the “clean your plate” impulse. Maybe it stems from habit more than appetite, that get it before it’s gone situation we may have grown up with. Maybe it comes from eating fast and not giving satiety a chance to happen before you’re chock full. Yes, it’s a kind of psychological experiment. I know for a fact eating slower helps me eat a proper amount. And it never hurts to load your plate less if your food isn’t in danger of disappearing. :cowboy_hat_face:

(Jack Bennett) #538

That’s a good point. I definitely don’t think it’s a harmful suggestion. Maybe it works for some.

My experience is that back when I was eating lots of carbs (I.e. addicted) and exposed to ad libitum food that I really liked (e.g. at an Indian buffet), my enthusiasm and appetite would blow away any such trickery.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #539

I always overdid it at a buffet too, tricking myself into think I would enjoy it only to be in a post gorge comatose state feeling miserable. There’s something challenging about making sure you get your money’s worth even at the expense of feeling well afterwards. :cowboy_hat_face:

(traci simpson) #540

We would have soda in 12 oz bottles on Saturdays only.

(Scott) #541

I attended and later worked at a boys summer camp for many summers. The kids were allowed only one 7 oz coke per summer as a special treat. We all survived.

(traci simpson) #542

We stayed outside until the street lights came on! Played all day!

(PJ) #543

I’ve been reading the https://fireinabottle.net/ blog (start at post one and then read forward). I’m a Hyperlipid fan but much is over my head, but this guy has basically rendered for the slightly dimmer of us what Peter is saying, plus some of his own waxing on. It is absolutely fascinating.

One thing it suggests is that saturated fat vs. everything else (including monoU) might make a really big difference in fat loss. I swear if you read through the posts (none are very long) it will make sense.

This might explain why some people do surprisingly well on all meat because most of them eat a lot of beef. It may not have everything else they need or want eventually but it really might be the best thing for actual fat loss / body composition.

There’s one study he exampled in there where the satfat animals had higher intake of calories but lost more fat. That’s one example of how calories alone may not be all to consider.

(Heather Meyer) #544

it doesnt… we say Waaaaaaahhhhffles
Who pronounces woffles as o in canada?

(PJ) #545

Good point. My (adult) daughter has this problem. She tells me that most the time she is just never really satiated or ‘full.’ That she has a drive, a need, a want, to FEEL ‘full.’ But it seems like she never really gets there. She eats, and if she has enough food and is not consciously setting limits, she will eat until she is literally in pain or sick. But she never reached the point in there of FEELING that “satiation” factor that I guess the rest of us do. Yet she is kind of driven to feel it.

It made me think of when we have a bit of an ache and we have the sense of need to press on it. Like she always has that need to ‘press on’ something to feel full but instead she just goes from still hungry to sick.

That must really suck. I don’t know how to help her fix it.

(Justin Jordan) #546

That’s how I work.

In my case, I got used to it. That drive (for me) isn’t hunger - that’s mostly fairly blunted in me as well - but a drive to eat until I am stuffed, and often sick. I still have the impulse, I just (mostly) ignore it, which gets easier with time.

This quite possibly might be some kind of binge eating disorder related thing for me.The upshot is that I don’t find it onerous, day to day, to NOT do this. But it’s my default.

(Keto Koala 🐨) #547

David your a legend!! It’s thanks to you and your advice that has made me stop worrying about bloody calories. Those YouTube videos by that dr kendaberry or whatever his name is that you sent me are amazing. So THANKYOU SO MUCH :blush:

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #548

Bubby, when you want to get someone’s attention you can reply and/or quote their comment as I have done with yours. Just hit ‘Reply’ directly and to the right under their comment. When the editing window opens, you can select the word bubble on the extreme left of the toolbar to quote their entire comment. Conversely, to quote only a portion of the comment, first hightlight the desired portion, then select ‘Reply’.

If you don’t want to quote and/or reply to a specific post, you can use the @ symbol to get their attention directly. Like so: @David_Stilley

This is particularly useful when commenting on old topics that the person may not be following any longer.

#549

I lost 50 pounds while fat adapted and never once thought to look at the calorie number on the label, only the carbs/protein/fat content. I ate a lot of food at many hours of the day and night and never stalled. I guess I never heard of anyone saying calories should be restricted, I only heard that they do not matter so i went with that and was successful. Now I am getting back on the keto express to lose 30 more pounds.

#552

A nice thick salmon steak (wild caught not farmed) with the skin on is fantastic!