In the graphic, it looks to me like they are trying to say that one leads to the other. You start out with a Lillie bit of keytones, and later end up dead of Keto acidosis.
Where’s the similar chart showing carbohydrate intake leading to diabetes? Hmm???
“… if you haven’t got your health, you haven’t got anything.” -Count Rugen
I don’t understand if you are agreeing with what I had to say or not??? Ketoacidosis is one word that includes only the first 4 letters of ketosis. It is poorly trained people who confuse the 2.
I had a situation this past summer with a vet who did just that with my critically ill dog. He was such an arrogant ass. When I corrected him by saying she was in ketosis because she had been eating a raw diet and had not eaten at all for then 36+ hours, he argued with me despite the fact that she had low blood sugars. He clearly was confusing the 2 (ketosis and ketoacidosis). She died just a couple hours later of what was most likely leptospirious. He was just one of the stupid vets (4 in total) that I encountered in a period of less than 24 hours. I can’t begin to express how very, very horrible it was to have no control over the outcome of my sweet and very ill little dog was. Still looking for a good vet…
BDK is everything except the first and last in that list.
A good ketosis is over 0.2 and under 10 (or 15)
To get over 10, you’d need to have type 1 diabetes or some other impossibly unlikely thing going on.
“steak please, no fries. Can I get a salad and a portion of mayo with that please?”
It’s just soooooooooooo difficult…
I’m often unintentionally vague like that, sorry. Yes, I do agree with you. Fuzzy terminology. Certainly the two things are not the same, but get confused very easily. Previously, before about 2013 or so, I had never heard of Ketosis other than Keto acidosis. I’m of the opinion that all of the data is relevant, not just the part that proves my point. For example, if I were to explain computer malware, I would also talk about the difference between Worms, Viruses, and Trojans. Sure, their end result is the same, but how you get/prevent is not. Similarly, when talking about a Keto diet to someone that has never heard of it before, then Keto acidosis needs to be explained as well as the opposite when speaking about Keto acidosis.
My point was that the industry, be it the Carb Consortium, or medical institutions, they make many things as vague as possible. After all, they know better than you, they know they know better than you, and they want to be sure you know they know better than you know.
Look at what happens when you talk about Ketosis. I went through this at work when I discovered Keto a few years ago. I mentioned my diet, because a few others were talking about their own. When I mentioned that I dont eat ANY carbs, they were dumbfounded. They said “thats not possible! You need carbs. you cant live without them!” I replied, “Im standing right here.” So of course they called me a liar. sigh
I didnt know then what I know now. I had no idea really how it worked. It took getting T2D to get me actually interested in my health. I researched like my life depended on it, because it did.
So now when I hear doctors, nurses, dietitians say things like… “Well, you can try to eat that way, but it isnt sustainable”. It means one of two things…
1- They are genuinely clueless about Ketogenesis.
2- They are lying.
I’m somewhat of a technical expert (albeit self proclaimed), and if I told a customer that I’ve made their computer perfectly secure, I’d be lying. OR I’d be completely clueless about computer security. Seeing as its what I do (more pursuit than a study lately 
) I would be a horrible technician not to know enough, to know when I dont know enough. Unintentionally vague there, sorry.
So in my humble opinion, I’m fairly sure they know about it. So why would they be lying? Again, IMHO, curing people of Diabetes, is less profitable than treating them. You treat the disease, try to make it manageble to survive, albeit with horrible complications, you the doctor make money because they keep coming back. Its that simple. Ockham’s Razor: the simplest solution is usually the right one.
I can’t and don’t believe doctors need people coming back and that is why they give bad advice. I know too many doctors and they are truly clueless when it comes to nutrition as a tool for improving health. It is their training (or lack of ) and they are swamped with new drug therapies. So much so that they can’t begin to hear something so ‘radical’. Where I live, doctors are swamped with patients (i.e. shortage of docs). Repeat patients is the last thing they need.
If you were to argue that drug companies are in the know and don’t want to share that knowledge ~ that I would believe. They stand to lose the most financially.
And doctors are paid by pharmaceutical companies to write scripts for their brand, giving unscrupulous MD’s incentive to do the same.
I have a hard time believing that doctors don’t know or understand it. Maybe specialists, say an orthopedic maybe, deals about as much with nutrition as what deals with bone growth/mending (my opinion, I have no idea what they need to know about nutrition). But when giving advice about something, something life threatening, I just cant believe a doctor wouldn’t be fully versed in it. After all, its been used as a treat for epilepsy for about 100 years!
Oh, um… I guess that bit of info proves your point too. As I read that they make it sound like its something new, not 100 years old. But it was used as early as 1911 in France to control epilepsy, and eventually had a 90% cure rate vs patients on the meds at the time with about a 25% rate.
The more I look, the more I am beginning to agree with you. They really just might be clueless. Perhaps its the learning institutions. Probably funded by ‘big pharma’ and want to keep their big $$ from them so they tend to leave certain things out for the doctors to figure out on their own.
That’s illegal nowadays.
There would be little financial incentive unless the MD actually works for the pharma company doing talks etc.
I’ve read that it’s also possible in end-stage Type II, when your pancreas is completely fried, but that fits your criterion of “impossibly likely,” right?
That is an example.
A type II with high insulin needs and not injecting insulin.
Or Type 1.5 - LADA.
I’m a regular No Agenda listener. I’d love to hear them deconstruct the food pyramid and official guidelines
8 pounds of high quality protein for 75 cents a pound. Headed for my Instant Pot, then the freezer. This lifestyle is so unaffordable and unsustainable!
What are your plans for your protein? Always looking for good chicken recipes. My problem is I had a great ketchup terriyaki recipe marinade that I have not found a good substitute
They honestly are clueless, especially anyone who does not do a lot of continuing ed and graduated before 1985. More than half my family is in healthcare in one form or another (I am not). I am the one sending them articles that are news to them. I have a close relative, late 70s, mild T2D for 20 years who had an MI and bypass over a year ago, TOFI. I got him to give up the carbs mostly but not add the fat! He is no longer on T2 meds and he was a general physician for 40 years. He was the first to say, if I had known I could give up carbs and avoid the T2 meds I would have done it years ago! Yeah sure! When he was eating rye bread (sort of whole grain) 10 years ago and I told him not to, he yelled at me and told me his diet was ok. Bottom line, they will not do it for themselves because they are not told that it is necessary and even recent graduates (friend’s daughter graduated from DO school last June) get no nutrition training. Cancer patients are told, yes you need to lose weight because there is a connection between obesity and cancer but there is no connection between cancer recurrence and sugar. This from a top suburban oncology group in an affluent educated area outside a major city!
As for the man or woman on the street, yes they are happy with their bread and circuses but they would listen to their physicians. Maybe not everyone, maybe not all the time but since the guidelines changed to avoid saturated fat in 1977, the developed world has reduced consumption significantly and increased consumption of sugar in its place. If the alarm were sounded that sugar and seed oils were dangerous, many would heed. I believe many people want to do the best for the health. Look how many people chow down on bran flakes? I cannot imagine a more disgusting breakfast. They are not eating it because they like the taste but because they were told it is good by experts.
I have another relative, married to a physician, mother of a physician, who has an idiopathic pain. She is otherwise healthy as far as I know. She eats a better version of Sad, lots of whole grains, salads, lean meats and of course is afraid of fat. She has never had a weight problem. She has been to the top clinics in the US to address her issue. Whenever I suggest modifying her diet, she snaps at me and tells me I have no clue or medical degree. In fact we were discussing another friend of mine who is T2 and bedridden. I keep trying to get her to LC. Anyway my relative commented that this person is being treated by experts in endocrinology, what makes me think that I can do a better job than these experts. To which I replied that the experts were literally killing my friend and I had to watch it happen in slow motion. Her comment was that maybe my friend does not want my help and is exercising her choice. I gave up and changed the subject
I’m going to cook most of it in my Instant Pot with minimal seasoning, then freeze in small packages. I’m going to save 6 drumsticks out to “bread” with pork rinds and fry in bacon grease. I’ve been wanting to try it and this is a perfect opportunity. I haven’t had chicken ANYTHING in about 2 weeks.
Something you need to constantly remind yourself on your journey through life. You are not responsible for the decisions of others. The best you can do is show them the science. If they refuse to listen, that’s on them, not on you. I went round and round with this myself for months now. You might show them this forum, especially the before and after pictures. Find all the stories here told by those with T2D, and what they have accomplished. Let them discover that they have been lied to for decades. They will respond better to what they discover on their own.
