Antihistamines interfering with ketosis and weight loss

(Bean) #1

I’m surprised this study hasn’t gotten more attention considering it is 5 years old. It is somewhat densely- written.

My take away? Histamine (and other enzymes) regulate hunger and ketosis, and anything that interferes with that (H1-reducing medications in particular, H2-reducing to a lesser extent), interferes with natural hunger signals and ketosis.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1550413118305795

So I guess for those of us who have trouble getting or staying in ketosis or losing weight, perhaps one the of the questions we should ask is, “Do you take any antihistamines?”

Personally, yes I do. A lot of them. I am trying to cut back. It turns out there is such a thing as antihistamine withdrawal, though. And antihistamines are in so many things- sleep aids, cold meds, OTC diuretic meds, motion sickness meds… and probably more.

(Alex) #2

Interesting hypothesis. I am on an antipsychotic olanzapine that also acts as an antihistamine, which has cured my histamine intolerance but has definitely changed how my body handles ketosis and made me prone to gaining weight. Before the med I could handle 35g carbs a day and still lose weight quickly and easily and stay in ketosis and even go up to 50g on occasion once adapted, whereas now I do best on 15-20g carbs and anything over 25g makes me cold and shaky and kicks me out of ketosis.

I found an interesting study showing an h2 antagonist reversed olanzapine weight gain

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0006322300008726

I would be curious if more common antihistamines have a similar effect. I became dependent on citirizine (a daily antihistamine) years ago and the withdrawal itching and autoimmune flares was awful.

I had to go on the autoimmune protocol to manage the withdrawal symptoms, but autoimmune keto with OMADs a couple of times a week did allow me to lose weight and heal. I now follow pretty much carnivore as an extreme version of autoimmune keto, and am a bit worried my histamine intolerance will come back if i stop the olanzapine!

(Bean) #3

Interesting. The way the study reads, other H2 antagonists might do the same thing. The authors had the data on the one in the study because it was prescribed and it was easier for them to make the connections?

Fortunately I was never on daily citirizine, but sort of rotated through two first-generation and three second generation H1 antagonist meds. Plus flo-nase, astropro, and cromolyn sprays.

I’ve been carnivore for 15 ish months, meat only for the last 2-3, and OMAD on and off for most of that time. I have not lost any weight, and actually gained some this fall. It seems to defy logic, really, since I’m on my feet most of the day, like to hike and am generally active.
I never seem to get into ketosis, even when I did a five day fast. I’ve never had a keto blood meter, though, so maybe it’s time. I do need the ketones for health reasons.

I’ve stopped the oral antihistamines. So far insomnia is my main side effect, but I added an extremely low dose (5 mg) of Prednisone that I keep around for flares. I’m tapering that right now and also cutting caffeine.

I have wicked histamine intolerance, so I’m trying DAO, B6, and fat-soluble vitamin C before (low histamine) meals. It does seem to help in the very limited time I’ve been doing it.

#4

The *pines are the absolute worst ones for weight gain in people. That the only one that works for you?

and anything over 25g makes me cold and shaky and kicks me out of ketosis.

You ever run a full thyroid panel on yourself? Also just FYI, coming out of ketosis takes a while, you burn everything you have until it’s gone, regardless of carbs. We say things like “kicked out”, but that’s really not how it works. Espeically for an actual keto’r that never totally refills liver glycogen, let alone muscle glycogen which then (only when that’s full) starts spilling over and then you’re actually out for real. Your liver doesn’t hold much, and most people requires like 150g+ to refill that.

(Alex) #5

Good luck with your taper and histamine intolerance, and the caffeine cutting!

That’s curious about your experiences with carnivore and OMAD. It can be so frustrating the mysteries of losing weight. I do feel like when I do just meat without added fat it does something to stress out my body and I don’t lose weight, maybe starvation mode I’m not sure. But paradoxically I lose more weight when my total grams of protein:fat are about equal, which usually means I add about 50-80g butter a day unless i’m eating really fatty pork.

I would have thought on a 5 day fast you’d be in ketosis for sure. although you’d have to get a ketone metre to check i guess.

Hope your experiments go well!

(Alex) #6

Yeh it worked wonders for my symptoms but sadly makes me ravenous and sleepy. I had what my therapist believes is drug induced psychosis, so I’m hopeful now I’m sober that I can come off it, but I get intense anxiety and panic attacks at the moment when I drop the dosage, so I think my nervous system and body need more time in a state of artificial chillness before I can get through the withdrawals. It makes me dumb AF though so I want to come off it so I can eventually have some hope of returning to work. It’s as bad as being stoned so even though i’m off weed and other drugs now I feel like my mental capacities aren’t much better. I’m not talking to myself and spirits and hallucinating fires running around screaming for weeks on end and dangerously underweight though so i’ll take the frustrating side effects for now.

Yeh I have subclinical hypothyroidism which cant be helping with the weight gain, brain fog, cold shakes etc. I tried OMAD and it made it worse so sticking with 16:8 dirty carnivore for now and started supplementing multivit, D, magnesium and folate.

Interestingly now I’m back at 6 weeks + on consistent keto I can go a bit above 20g carbs without getting cold or shaky, so I think the problem was just that I was still getting into stable ketosis at the time. Now I only get cold and shaky if I go too long without eating, which I’m hopeful will improve as I get more fat adapted at the 3-6month mark.

#7

It’s definitely not, (Endo’s especially) love to insult people with “subclinical” which is a joke. If your T3 is low, you’re hypo, that’s one you can’t work around minus literal starvation. If you are, it needs to be fixed. Thyroids are literally the easiest thing to correct, yet they never want to, and then when they do half the time they only pretend, they either dismiss “subclinical” and try to not treat, or go to NDT’s that rarely work, or if your “lucky” they’ll treat your low T3, with T4, which (sometimes) helps, but many times doesn’t, then they refuse to give you the T3 you’re low on.

But definitely address it. Trying to lose weight when your Thyroid is half asleep is like trying to dig yourself out of a hole.

There’s always the online options like Paloma that are about optimization, and not wasting your time, pretty much the thyroid equivalent of a TRT clinic.