8 year keto veteran now struggling


(Maria Ortiz) #1

8 years ago I started keto and had beyond amazing success. My highest weight was 216 lbs and I got down fo 106 lbs in a matter of 6 months. Once I added in exercise I got down to 96 lbs (I’m only 5’2) and my vitals and labs were the best they’d ever been. I maintained that for several years until I got pregnant this past November. I tried hard to stay on keto this time but was horribly ill and had a huge aversion to protein. I went off it for 2 months but unfortunately lost the baby. In those 2 months I gained a ridiculous amount of weight, nearly 30 lbs. I’ve been back on keto for almost 2 months now and haven’t experienced any weight loss yet. I had been on and off keto a few times before due to 2 previous pregnancies and have always gone back on and seen immediate success. This time doesn’t feel the same. I don’t have that initial nausea, no keto breath, and no whoosh of water weight I normally experience very quickly while on keto. I’m doing everything exactly as I always had. Maybe it’s just me being frustrated and not thinking rationally. I’m somewhat impatient as summer is approaching and I want to look and feel my best. I once heard that for some people, keto won’t work again once it’s been discontinued, is this really true?


#2

Sorry about the baby.

It’s not that it won’t work this time around, but it sounds like your body has been through a lot lately, so your body is likely trying to stick to homeostasis, so it’s not stressing. It might take longer to get the same results.


(Karen) #3

I think a keto will likely work every single time. Sorry to hear about the loss of your baby. Your body has a lot of things to heal. Stay the course, take care of yourself, and have patience


(Katie) #4

I am terribly sorry for the loss of your baby.
I hope that you do not mind me saying, but 130-140 pounds is a fine weight to be, given your height. Yes you got down to 96-106 pounds, but that seems quite low. I am thinking that it might have been too low for what your body ‘wanted’. Some of your weight gain may have been healthy and necessary. Often if our bodies are too low in weight they enter a ‘starvation mode’, and hold on to weight if it is gained. I think that the best thing that you can do is have a healthy level of calories, exercise 3-4 days per week, work on keeping stress low (this will help your weight goals, btw), and focus on health. I recommend maybe finding a coach to help you. My suggestion is Crystal Love from ketosavage.com


#5

My guess is that your body is fighting a lot of hormones. Both from the loss of the baby and likely the stress and emotions surrounding that and the illness that preceded it. I think this is probably a KCKO situation, although I know you really want something to happen faster. Looking your best for summer is definitely motivating.

Condolences on your loss.


(mole person) #6

Keto will work again but a lot of time has passed and you may need to be a bit stricter. Do you eat a lot of dairy or nuts? Do you snack? How strict are you about following the <20 grams of carbs? Are you tracking?

I’m sure that you know your own body and that 96 pounds is fine for you. People have very different frames. I’m 106 lbs at 5’5 and so is another lady on this forum, and both of us still have plenty of body fat.


(Maria Ortiz) #7

In reference to my weight, I do have a condition called lipedema which causes an unusual amount of fat to be stored in the legs and hips. It’s currently in stage one and keto has been the only thing that has helped keep it that way. My weight being in the 90’s has been the only thing that has made my legs look normal and proportionate to the rest of my slim body. That being said, my weight was lower at first at 89 lbs before I started weight training. And even at that low weight, my body fat percentage was high because of my condition. I went a long time being self conscious about my larger legs and keto finally made me look and feel normal again. So this 30 lbs I just gained has gone almost entirely to my lower half, which makes me feel and look horrible again. Thanks for the advice, I will be patient but I’m not gonna like it.


(Maria Ortiz) #8

I’m the strictest of anyone I know on keto. My carb intake is no more that 3 to 4 grams a day. As far as nuts/seeds, I only eat 2 oz (weighed) roasted sunflower seeds a day. The only dairy I eat is 1 oz of cheese a day, usually string cheese which is easist on-the-go. The only other things in my diet are eggs and meat, including pork rinds and the fats I use to cook them. I eat zero artificial ingredients and zero artifical sweeteners. I religiously read food labels and won’t even touch salt or other spices with added ingredients. And I drink about 8 bottles of water a day (16 oz each). This is how I first started keto and experienced such massive weight loss, and I’ve stuck to this for years. Sometimes I go higher carb with some extra veggies when I feel depleted or in a stall. I did that initially and it did not help, so I remain strict. I don’t see why I’m still holding onto so much water weight. I haven’t lost any of it. Very discouraging.


(Katie) #9

The human condition, haha. Well Godspeed. Please let me know if you are looking for resources/advice about coaching or anything else and I will try to help you. I just hate to see people suffering through weightloss–often people damage their metabolisms and make things worse for themselves in the long-term.


(Maria Ortiz) #10

Thanks a bunch. After so many years I was the one who was coaching others. I’ve helped a lot of friends, family, and colleagues experience success on keto. The fact that I now have to ask others for advice makes me feel like a failure.


(mole person) #11

You do sound like you know what you’re doing. I think perhaps you should wait a bit longer as your hormones might just be out of whack right now.

If that doesn’t work there are a couple of options. For me regular keto wasn’t getting me all the way back to the figure that I like for myself. I was stuck about ten pounds higher. I started an intermittent feeding schedule with only one meal a day. On keto this was easy. Those last pounds flew off.

Another possibility is that the hormonal changes from your pregnancy might not just return to normal. Amber O’Hearn says keto stopped working for her after a pregnancy. She said she gained weight on keto after this, although not as much as she gained off it. That is what led her to try a carnivore diet. She lost the weight and has stuck with it for a decade. Michaela Peterson has a similar story. Health benefits that she was getting from keto before a pregnancy stopped abruptly after pregnancy. However, going carnivore brought them back. Both of these ladies do a high-fat, ketogenic, no dairy version of the carnivore diet.


(Maria Ortiz) #12

I’m hoping it is just hormones and temporary. But I first went on keto after my first baby and it worked immediately, then again after my 2nd baby with immediate affects. I’m struggling over whether to exercise now or wait until after I see weight loss. I’m naturally a very active person but don’t want to affect my weight loss negatively. Thanks for the info on carnivore, I never thought about it before but will consider it if I don’t seee results by next month. Those people you spoke about on carnivore, were they able to go back on keto with no adverse effects? Or did they have to remain carnivore? Thanks.


(mole person) #13

In both those cases they stayed carnivore but not because of weight loss. Amber started carnivore for weight loss, and had intended to stop after three months, but stayed because it helped her severe depression. Michaela Peterson also stayed because it was helping both depression and another very serious health issue.

There is no reason you can’t go back after a while. I’ve done that myself.


(Allie) #14

hugs

I think you should ease up on yourself and allow yourself to heal more, both physically and emotionally, and let the fat loss happen when the time is right :heart:


(Katie) #15

You are not a failure. Doctors do not have practice on themselves; athletic coaches have their own coaches; lawyers have their own lawyers.

You did not gain weight and contract lipidemia on purpose. You have been pursuing a healthy lifestyle and body for years. These things happen and it is great that you are trying to figure ths out to get healthier. There is no reason why you should feel guilty and beat yourself up about this; you did nothing wrong.

Also something that I just thought of–a miscarriage can be traumatic to the hormones, which affect weight fluctuations.


(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #16

I’m so sorry for your loss. I can only guess what you must be going through right now.

Since you carried the other babies to term, that alone might explain the difference. A miscarriage is unfinished business, and the hormonal milieu may need more time to settle. You didn’t go through the stress of labor and delivery, you didn’t get the oxytocin release, you didn’t have the caloric expenditure of nursing. This time, your body was still gearing up for the pregnancy, when it got interrupted. Add to that all the emotional stress you’re going through, and you’ve got quite a hormonal situation to straighten out. Give yourself plenty of time to get back to normal, both emotionally and physically.


(Bunny) #17

Was looking at your entire description and it sounds more like the progressive onset of lipedema issues if not treated early enough can lead to surgical intervention? And more than a general adipose fat issue: “…lipedema can be mistaken for regular obesity?..”

I never even knew this existed?

[1] LIPEDEMA-THE DISEASE THEY CALL FAT 10 minute trailer

[2] Medicine and Supplements for People with Lipedema and Dercum’s Disease (DD)


(Maria Ortiz) #18

A lot of people don’t know of the condition and I didn’t either. Since my mid teens I thought I was fat when I was actually very slim but viewed the extra fat on my lower half as obesity. It made me give up on exercise and being healthy because that fat didn’t wanna budge. That’s when I gained a ton of weight, which exacerbated the issue. It wasn’t until halfway through keto that I noticed my lower half still had tons of excess fat and most of the weight was coming off my upper half. That’s when I sought opinions from doctors who diagnosed the condition. It was a relief because I finally knew it wasn’t my fault.The only way I could make my legs look like the rest of my body is by getting to a very low weight, which finally caused fat to come off that area. Anything over 100 lbs looks abnormal because it doesn’t distribute evenly. Doctors say I’m still in stage 1 and keto seems to keep it in check, hence the reason I’m frustrated.


#19

Well, you have two young children, and have recently lost an established pregnancy (a huge change on all levels) - so your body may well have quite high cortisol levels at the moment. Parenting young children can also be extremely demanding to the brain (requiring good electrolytic hydration - which involves salt + water - not simply plain water) and also, postpartum hormonal issues are pretty common in today’s industrial culture - so be kind to yourself first and foremost. Lots of postpartum and post-miscarriage women may have hormonal havoc related to induction of stress or other interventions, and experience lowered metabolisms or negative effects on their monthly cycles.

To help lower cortisol and sooth the hind brain for those who are fully established in keto - 2-3 well-satiating fatty meals a day on the ‘keto-cusp’ (cycling somewhere between 50-100gr total carbs, depending on the day - more of a ‘paleo-keto’ perhaps, mostly whole foods carbs only) can modulate things to be more comforting to the hormonal healing of many women, apparently. Females often have serious cortisol responses with the primal nervous system. And both males and females may do better to cycle a bit more in their ketosis states rather than aiming to stay in ‘deep ketosis’.

In addition - using adaptogenic herbs for glandular health & hormonal support can be heartening and supportive (Ginger lowers cortisol, clears fibrin, speeds enzymatic production, and is a very strong antiinflammatory - it’s my fave adaptogen and circulatory aid, and is also very economical. Ashwaganda, Turmeric, and Rhodiola are other famous adaptogens I know of, along with supplementing with grassfed liver which has high B vitamins). Other cortisol-reducing/managing things include daily embodiment meditation (mindfulness), as well as singing, laughing, and dancing!

Re lipidema, it’s a relatively new western label for a certain kind of imbalance that in eastern medicine would be seen through a different lens and with fire/water balancing remedies that often focus on digestive healing and the use of gustatory spices (for aroma and for taste) to assist one’s “fire”, vital circulation, and reduction of stagnation in the gut and/or circulatory & lymphatic systems.

The circulatory system in the lower body slows and speeds according to a variety of factors including protein levels (chronic venous insufficiency (CVI) for example, is remedied by higher protein levels), salt levels (in keto, Dr. Phinney recommends from 3-5grams sodium per day (1-2 stock cubes plus liberally salting one’s meals). Not enough salt can result in edema as well as too much salt! Salt is a major player in the body and interplays with hormonal realities (estrogen is water-holding and cortisol is fat holding, if I understand correctly).

You said you “won’t even touch salt” and that’s a concern - as salt (esp good sea salt) is key for the body’s hydration through carrying water deep into the cells to support all processes. So, if you’re drinking all that water (8 x 16oz per day) without proper salt levels you’re actually not absorbing the water correctly and the body may be in cellular dehydration and overcompensating by holding water.

The cortisol-carb connection is interesting and powerful. Females with higher cortisol in a LCHF/keto context may actually benefit from slightly higher or more regular carbs or more meals (2-3 a day and only infrequent IF) to reduce the cortisol response! Body recomposition is hormonal healing, and the cortisol levels have to change in order to recompose. There has been discussion on this here in the forum, and also in other articles and comments on the Bulletproof blog, and Mark’s Daily Apple.

Lastly - the tendency towards excess water in the lower body along with excess fat there can be multifactorial - related to stress/trauma histories (whether recent obstetric trauma or previous sexual violence or simply physical trauma due to childhood injuries and subsequent tissue scar adhesions and stagnation etc). Trauma healing often changes physiology and functionality. Sometimes it’s just genetic histories that involve food scarcity (as in 3+ generations ago) and results in females with a tendency towards wider hips and very pear-shaped lower body fat. When I last investigated this subject (as I’m prone to lower body water weight) the lipedema resources out there I found didn’t address various factors, and certainly not dietary healing! For me personally, LCHF/keto (with plenty of good sea salt and also supplementation with angstrom magnesium has been the only thing that’s ever helped me reduce longterm lower body fat).

The cortisol influence that tends to hold water and store fat in the female body can be mitigated - and being very kind to ourselves is key. Exploring circulatory and adaptogenic herbal allies can be encouraging (Ginger in the dry encapsulated form is amazing as mentioned, Butcher’s Broom is another amazing water-clearing ally but is more expensive - and good quality organic white wine in moderate amounts (usually diluted a lot with water I believe) is an ancient diuretic that goes all the way back to Greek & Roman medicine).

I hope some of this helps you sort what’s going on, and do the self care needed to get your electrolytes and hormones sorted. Goddess-speed! :herb::avocado::coconut::steakcake::sheep: :herb:


(Rob Grantham) #20

Could I just ask at what level of carbs you were at before starting?Do you have a lot to lose? And what’s your current salt intake? I know you mentioned you don’t like salt but as mentioned above sodium is key to fluid balance. Great response above about keeping cortisol levels to a minimum. I’m constantly trying to “trick” my body into losing weight by changing things up but what I’ve seen is that this has to be very incrementally . Anything more than this and it’s a huge strain on the body’s systems. Our mind sometimes tried to prush things along but the body has different ideas.