20:4 Fast style help!

fasting
(Heather Meyer) #1

Hey all…

So… i’m 3 weeks into Keto and loving it. What i love more than Keto is fasting. I love the two together. Though i am only 3 weeks in, i can fadt for hours without ever getting hungry anymore. I naturally seem to have fallen into a 20:4 fast and today became a 22:2 fast. So here is my question

  1. Most fast days in which im doing 20:4 or 22:2 , when i eat my first break-fast, i dont feel hungry. My appetite has taken a dive. So i do not get my macro amounts for the Day. Is this okay right now? For reference i have 80lbs to lose, so should i worry about lack of calories if i can fast easily? What would be the scientific reason why appetite would be diminished right after a fast?

  2. When i did fasting last year… every time i broke my 20 hour fast, i had to zoom to the bathroom 20 minutes later…it felt like in and out. So this tiem i have been breaking my fast with either a keto sandwich made wirh psyllium husk or high fibre mini muffin made with psyllium husk. Good news!! I dont have the bathroom problem BUT…i get very bloated when i eat an actual meal an hour later and gassy and full. Is there a reason for this? How can i combat that issue? Cause i love fasting and want to do it daily but i dont like how i feel after ive eaten.

Is 20:4 or 22:2 okay to use daily. I know Dr. Fung says Omad can stall but will i stall if i have fat to lose and im eating not just one meal but seversl small ones post fast? I do try and switch my fadting routine around to incorporate some 16:8 as well

(Bob M) #2

The fiber causes the bloat. Fiber is bad.

When does Dr. Fung say one meal a day can cause one to stall?

(Heather Meyer) #3

Or maybe its Megan Ramos? I just keep hearing it said around these boards…

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #4

OMAD was one of the fasting strategies Megan Ramos talked about at Ketofest in July. I don’t remember her saying it was bad at all.

(Heather Meyer) #5

People on here have been saying

“Doing OMAD will cause a weight loss stall which is why it is not recommended for weight loss”

(Short224) #6

You are right I’ve been seeing that as well saying your body will eventually get used to it then stall out .

(Erin ) #7

Wait can you elaborate on this???
I have been stalled for months and can’t break it. I only eat once a day usually at night. So our body adapts to this and then stalls out???

How do we break it??? I too have barely an appetite. I don’t get hungry until late, and usually eat around 8 or later if I’m at work.

#8

Have a listen to this

Or read this https://idmprogram.com/wp-content/uploads/QA-32.pdf

(Robert C) #9

OMAD can easily be seen by the body as calorie restriction after a period of weight loss on it.
You basically adapt.

To continue weight loss after that, Dr. Fung and Megan Ramos seem to move to 36 and 42 hour fasts.
Personally, I think what is key is to have 1 or more full days off from eating (per week).

16/8 22/2 23/1 all allow eating each day.

Those meals (especially bigger OMAD type meals) are still digesting and providing calories for many hours.
To me this makes 23/1 not really 23 fasted hours at all.
A big meal at 6 PM and slowed digestion while sleeping means you could still be pulling calories (with raised insulin) until near (or past) noon the next day.

Stop eating Monday night - do not eat Tuesday and then eat again Wednesday - that is when you have Dr. Fung’s desire fulfilled (low insulin for a long time).

(Erin ) #10

Yes that makes total sense.
And I think the period of time when I was loosing weight was when I was doing the eat stop eat fast.
24 fast, 48 eat, 24 fast

(Robert C) #11

If you can do that then you could - for instance - fast 2 or 3 random full days per week.
I think it is best to avoid any pattern - not just to trick the body.
When you have a dinner date, a work related dinner meeting etc. you can just fast some other day (instead of feeling guilty about breaking some arbitrary self-imposed pattern).

#12

I’ve been doing a lot of EFs over the past 4 months and have had good results with 48, 60, 72 and longer fasts. When I return to 22/2 OMAD, however, my results come to a standstill.

I am about to end another 3+ day fast and had planned to begin alternating 36- of 42-hour fasts. I think your post convinces me I’m on the right track.

The 36 and 42s won’t beat me up as much and should be easier now that I have some good fasting muscle built up.

(Erin ) #13

Wow I’m glad I found this thread. This must be why I can’t come out of this stall. I’ve been pretty much eating the exact same times and things every day.
I’m definitely going to switch it up!
How have your weightloss results been with the EF? …If that’s your goal…

(KCKO, KCFO) #14

This plus Megan also has some info on it in the FB group. OMAD is good for maintenance according to the track records of IDM clients, but can cause stalls Better to mix it up.

(Robert C) #15

I can get about 3 pounds a week with 3 days off but, I am an about 200 pound male.

Two things to keep in mind doing this are being careful on the refeeds and weighing yourself.

On refeeds - unlike IF schemes, you are not refeeding trying to get the calories you missed out on with some idea that just the long time of low insulin is enough. With EFs you are definitely going lower calorie overall on a weekly basis. You avoid slowing metabolism though because you are not eating daily (on a day you actually do not eat at all, your metabolism goes up!).

On weighing yourself - be ready for some weight swings if you weigh often. If you weigh often you put yourself through a lot of pain because your weight drops (yeah!) but then goes back up (boo!). This can become upsetting even if you logically can understand the refeeding cycle. You feel like you deserve the “gains” (in terms of weight loss) and watching a 7 pound scale change down turn into only a 2 pound loss at the end of an EF is no fun. It is best to weigh at a consistently fed state (always at the end of the fast, always after the refeed etc.). The problem is, on a good randomized EF scheme, that might not be the same day each week.

(Heather Meyer) #16

So how long do you think you could OMAD consecutively before you need to switch it up?

So far…ive done 3 days of 22:2 together…
So do i need to have a feast day now?
How many days of OMAD could i do in a row before needing feast days?
For reference i need to lose 80 lbs

(KCKO, KCFO) #17

I just did 3 days of OMAD, it just felt like the thing to do, no hunger til around 4:30 pm, so I wouldn’t think about food til then. Yesterday I had a largish lunch and a light dinner in a 4 hr. eating window. Today, I am going back onto what I usually do for IFIng, a 12-6 PM eating window.

When you IF, you don’t need to feast, just eat regular meals. Feast and fast are for fasting days when no calories (except for a few in coffee) are consumed. When you are doing fasting, it is good to eat atleast one day that is heavier in fats, then start the fast. When you are done you should refeed well. Break it slowly with something light, and then an hour later, eat your regular keto/lchf meal.

With 80 lbs. to go, you should be able to do just about any fasting protocol you want to do when you are fat adapted. Your body will let you know if you are doing too much. As you get near goal weight, you might need supplemental fats. But that is probably down the road a bit for you.

Good luck sorting yourself out.

(Erin ) #18

You’ll know if your body gets adapted to the way you’re fasting. I’ve been doing OMAD this entire year and I’ve been stalled out at this weight for months.
Time to switch it up for me! Do it as long as it’s working. I have the book Eat Stop Eat. That’s a good one for the 24 hour fasts.