Test Breath Ketones without a Ketonix (using a cheap breathalyzer)

ketonix
acetone
breath
#629

The wide variation in people’s results seems to depend in part on whether they’re paying attention to the first number that comes up on the meter or the second. 0.02( an example of the first BAC number) and 0.25( the second number) are the same thing, just different ways of listing the percentage. The first is expressed as %, and the second as o/oo. The alarm goes off at 0.05 or 0.50, depending of which BAC percentage you’re reading.

Not sure I’m explaining it right but I see people being bummed out because other people are getting results like .16 while their result is a 0.01. Those results are probably the same thing. If you scroll through the results, you’ll see 4 numbers listed. I like the second because it gives the extra decimal point, but I realize that 0.46 and 0.04 are really the same result.

(Dan Tam Keto) #630

Absolutely. But the most crucial point is the model of the breathalyzer, I found the at6000 provide the most consistent results. And I bought three of them to compared the consistency. The sensitivity may vary a little when the ketosis levels are on the low side but if you are deep inn ketosis the readings on all three are consistent.
I bought also the key chain breathalyzer and that is much less sensitive. I prefer the at6000 much better personally.

(Dan Dan) #631

same here :smiley:

I love that I can check as many times as I want quickly and without pain :smiley:

(Dean Stamford) #632

Just wanted to take the time to thank everyone on this thread. It has been VERY useful

#633

New participant here. Bought a Ketonix bluetooth and cannot warn people enough to NOT bother getting one. Software is very buggy and the device is extremely slow to warm up. It displays ALL readings under whichever profile you last accessed instead of storing each person’s results in his/her own profile.Takes almost an hour for two of us to test our ketones. Contacting Ketonix is frustrating because their responsiveness is so slow as to be virtually non-existent. Have to pay shipping both ways and a $20 restocking fee. This was a $40 waste of time. We also have a cheap breathalyzer that we got while we waiting for the long delivery time of Ketonix. It works fine. Ketonix does not.

(Rita) #634

My weigh in on the greenwon AT6000. No pun intended. I finally broke down and ordered one to see if I was in ketosis or just fooling myself as weight loss has been slow. Reading some of the behavioral cues to being in ketosis such as metal mouth and mental clarity would suggest that I do have at least periods of ketosis. I guess my appetite is mostly suppressed as long as I don’t go too high on carbs. So first few days I got nothing, zero. I wondered if it was working so I tested it on my husband who is also low carb and he got a 0.5 reading. That was frustrating! Then I read about the 10second/6second method and tried it. Immediately 1.6. I waited for 10 minutes and did it the conventional method and got the same reading. Since then I am at times at 0 and at times get good readings. I usually have a fair idea if I am in ketosis by the way I feel. It is very helpful to be able to verify my behavioral cues. Since I am phobic about weighing this is a valuable method and helps me to stay the course…kcko!

(Carol Bassingthwaighte) #635

My experience was the same. Measured alcohol not ketones.

(Marc) #636

After using the Greenwon keychain breathalyzer for a few weeks, I must say this is a great tool for measuring breath ketones! I can accurately track the impact of meaIs and exercise with ease and basically no cost. I have not used the Greenwon AT6000, but the posts above give high praise for the extra decimal place of that device, so I might get the AT6000 sometime soon.

A couple notes for those who find it useful:

Remember that the breath ketones measured are just the acetone, so blood ketones, which include more than just acetone, are likely higher than found on your breath meter reading. When I measure blood ketones (Freestyle Precision Neo) at the same time as breath ketones, I find the blood ketones to be about 50% higher - eg. 1.2 blood ketones while having 0.8 breath ketones. If others have both blood and breath meters, please post your results or average ratio when you combine both tests, so others who do not have costly blood meters can have a better approximation from breath ketone numbers.

For those having trouble with a consistent breath test result (i.e. 3 consecutive tests within a couple minutes have wide-ranging results) and think it may be due to an inconsistent breathing technique, there are a couple options. One technique is to breathe in and out of a bag for 10 seconds to mix the air in the lungs, as is done to fix hyperventilation - but this is a bit much for most of us. A more simple and bag-free way is to take a 90% capacity breath, then for 10 seconds breathe in and out into your closed mouth as to puff up and then collapse your cheeks multiple times and circulate the air in your lungs to create a homogenous mix before breathing into the device. It is known that the highest concentration of ketones are at the hard-to-reach end of a breath that completely empties the lungs, so mixing the air in your lungs would ensure you don’t need to empty your lungs with as much accuracy each test.

Happy keto-ing!

(Lee) #637

I’m new to this and I might get the answer by spending hours reading the posts above but I might not so forgive me, but I purchased the AT6000 (same as what started this thread) and I’m anxious to understand what I’m seeing.

I’ve been doing keto for about 4 weeks and hoping to better understand what’s going on by taking measurements. I used a urine strip when about 48 hours into a water fast and it showed a color between 4 and 8. I understand urine strips won’t work once my body gets good at this so I tried the breathalyzer. I tried many times using the bottom of my breath. I consistently got .02 or .03.

I see that it is a flat surfaced alcohol sensor, which may be an upgrade from the original unit. Is this sensor too advanced to mistake acetone for alcohol? Do I need to shop for a different type sensor or is this one just faulty?

Thanks for any advice from those with experience with sensors.

BTW, I have lost 12 pounds in 4 weeks and one of those weeks I was on vacation with family and completely off the diet.

(karen) #638

This probably isn’t very helpful, sorry, but I’ve decided that as long as my cheapo breath meter registers anything and I haven’t been drinking, I take that as a yes, I’m in ketosis, and I don’t ask more of it than that. It does tend to register a higher number when I’ve been fasting, but it’s really not consistent at all with day to day readings.

(Steve) #639

The pee strips are pretty much useless. They don’t measure the levels of ketones in your blood…just what you’re expelling (which, again, all they’re really telling you is that you are in ketosis).

When I did side by side comparisons with my keto mojo (which I just sold) and the keychain Greenwon, the Greenwon displays accurate results, but you need to keep in mind that it’s rounding. 0.01 is 1.x mmol/l. That is a range of 0.5-1.4mmol/l
Similarly, a 0.02 means 1.5-2.4, a 0.03 means 2.5-3.4, etc, etc.

Also, if you don’t blow HARD, you’ll get a zero result.

But you really shouldn’t bother with the level of ketones in your blood…just that they’re there - that you ARE in ketosis is really all you should be concerning yourself with (as others have said).

(Todd Allen) #640

I’ve got 3 different breath meters and they each have a different degree of sensitivity. On one 0.03 BAC% corresponds to blood readings in the range of 0.5 to 1.0 mmol/l on another I’d get 0.02 at the same level and the other would only give 0.01. Curiously the ones least sensitive at the low end go up faster such that when my blood ketones are around 4 mmol/l they all read about 0.10 BAC%. Despite their wildly different calibrations they all respond fairly consistently and regardless of which one I use first I can pretty well guess what the other two will show.

In summary, if you want to know what your blood ketones are you will need to measure them and see how they match up to your breath meter. Since breath and blood measure two different things their relationship isn’t fixed and over time you may see drift in the values. I’ve taken to measuring blood ketones about every 4 months going through a 10 pack of strips to compare against my breath meters.

(Lee) #641

Karen, Steve, Todd… All 3 of your answers were helpful. I don’t think I can count on the breath meter for very much. I was trying to figure out how long it takes my body to measure being in keto on a fast. I tested with a pee stick and with the breath meter every couple of hours after 12 hours fasting and had zero until 26 hours into the fast. At that point the pee stick was still not registering, so maybe after trying this for nearly a month I’m already not urinating acetone anymore, and I suddenly had .03 on the breath meter - yay I’ve confirmed keto! But since then on 3 subsequent breath tests, I’ve got zero again. I know I’m in keto. I am just going to go by how my body feels as long as I’m getting good results. I hate to buy a blood meter but if I quit getting good results, I’ll have to get one if I want to really figure out what’s going on. Thanks for your help.

(Michael) #642

I personally don’t think a blood meter will make things any clearer for you. Stick with the breath meter or consider a Ketonix if you want a well calibrated quality breath meter which records all your readings for future analysis or almost instant feedback on how various foods are affecting your ketosis levels.
I think the blood meters are only to be recommended for diabetics who are at risk of going into ketoacidosis. This is my major takeaway from all the ketosis level testing threads.

(German Ketonian) #643

Considering the price and if people are only interested in a binary measurement (which makes most sense, as acetone always comes delayed with respect to food), I don’t think the ketonix makes sense for most of us. Even blood ketones aren’t produced instantly, but with significant delay. That said, the question is really, what the actual comparison of continuous values really tell you, even if you account for measurement errors.

And additionally, research is still out on whether the level of ketosis even has an impact apart from therapeutic purposes. To me, this makes the ketonix considerably less attractive. The binary measurement of the breathalizers works extremely well and reliable, if you find your method and stick to it. The only real drawback (which isn’t even one for me since I don’t drink alcohol) is that the breathalizers can’t distinguish alcohol from acetone.

(Lee) #644

Ok, Michael - so the blood meter is out, and now I’m getting a .04 on the breathalyzer consistently throughout today which lets me know that I haven’t tripped myself up.

Ketonian, I was originally wondering how long it takes my body to go back into ketosis after I’ve had too many carbs and was hoping to estimate that from the breathalyzer. Do you know how much delay there is, once your body has used all the glucose available, before it makes ketones, and then before you will be able to see a non-zero reading on a breathalyzer?

If I know that then I can test how much I’m derailed by x number of carbs, and plan my diet accordingly.

(Bill Emmons) #645

The melters cops use will not work, they use a different measurement device. Only the cheap meters will work.

(Michael) #646

Ketonix%20Data%20Jan-June2018
Ketonix Data Jan-June2018.JPG797×729 63.6 KB

I think that I can see from the graph that continuous readings on the Ketonix indicate that I have improved my level of ketosis since the beginning of January, particularly from mid February when I started some Alternate Day Intermittent Fasting which I have eased off on in the last month to 16/8 on weekdays. ~I have been on vacation for the last 2 weeks and not measuring or I would show a full graph.~ I do not measure at weekends and I have now started to delete a reading if it is spiked high in particular.

The change I see in the level of breath acetone in relation to food consumption is a reduction in the level of ketosis if the foods are carb loaded. There is no noticeable increase in the level of ketosis by consuming food except perhaps exogenous ketones which I don’t bother with…

I don’t understand this statement. What research?

Yes but some users on here are getting more than binary measurements from their devices but that sort of analysis takes research, perseverance and considerable intelligence. I don’t measure my inputs. I do measure my acetone levels though to monitor when I am eating or fasting. The Ketonix has it’s advantages in being well calibrated and it costs no more than the blood ketone devices after one months use. Non-diabetics seem to be using blood ketone meters without much satisfaction or indeed reason.

(German Ketonian) #647

There is not research. that’s precisely the point. No one knows whether high levels of ketosis are better than low levels apart from therapeutic purposes. So to me this means that a binary measurement is all I care for. Chase results, not ketones, be it blood or breath!

I cite Ben Bikman: “As long as the blood ketone monitor doesn’t say low, I am good with that” - I am the same.

This thread is precisely about NOT using the ketonix and using the cheap breathalizers. Do whatever floats your boat, but it almost sounds like you’re trying to sell this thing to people around here. This is where it begins to get a bit hairy for me.

(Michael) #648

As I suspected you introduce the term “Binary” to imply that you are being logical in the Boolean sense of the word i.e. a Yes or No answer.

This implies that there is a range of research both positive and negative

Now you say there is no research?

This is a thread about measuring Breath Acetone and you introduce a quote about Blood Ketones to prove your point. That is not logical in relation to this discussion.

The point I am making is that I believe the measurement of Breath Acetone is positively correlated with being in Ketosis