Suggestion: Meal Replacement thread under Food

quick-meals
#22

Hmmmm. Tricky one this. For me, it brings back nightmares of Slimfast. I think it is a potentially worrying thing to make part of the norm of a keto woe and strays in to eating disorder territory.

Basically, its seems to be protein powder mixed with cream and maybe MCT oil as well. A number of people have problems with whey protein and get an insulinogenic response to it.

Personally, I don;t think it warrants a category to itself, no. I don’t see it as any more or less a meal replacement than BPC. It is probably best just left under “Food” in the same way a post on BPC would be.

Ultimately though, the best people to decide this are @richard and @carl

(Derek I. Batting) #23

Please explain how it is a gateway to an eating disorder? My eating disorder was bingeing on carb-heavy carb bombs dipped in carbs and washed down with carbs. If it weren’t for keto shakes, I’d likely be full-blown T2D and 250+ lbs by now. If anything, they saved me from myself.

n=1

(Derek I. Batting) #24

This.

(Derek I. Batting) #25

Aaaaanyway, back to the reason for the request/suggestion for it’s own subforum. Keto shakes / meal replacements are already “part of the norm” and there are many on the market to compare, contrast and discuss. That’s why I brought up having a place to do so that wouldn’t clog up the general areas and people would know exactly where to look for those discussions.

(Disclaimer: not advertising here. Just displaying.)
Some of the more common keto shakes are:

Myoplex:

Keto Fuel:
http://superbodyfuel.com/shop/keto-fuel/

Aussielent:

Keto Chow:

KetoOne:

Ketolent

EPXBody:

Just to name a few…

#26

Apologies. That should have said “strays” - I have corrected. I think I mentioned that, for me, it is very reminiscent of Slimfast shakes. As the occasional meal replacement used like BPC (even maybe daily for breakfast say), I don’t think it is necessarily a bad thing although I am not a fan of a lot of the ingredients. I mentioned the issue re whey so no need to repeat that.

I don’t agree with that. TBH, this is the first time I have heard them discussed although I suppose people bring protein shakes up from time to time. “Part of the norm” is an exaggeration IMO.

(Derek I. Batting) #27

You and a lot of other people. That’s also why I’m requesting a subforum for it. I’m not saying put a huge red neon sign over it to point people to it or anything, but those of us who do use them would like a place to do so and maybe answer questions, dispel myths, shares our stories, etc. That’s it. Not evangelizing or trying to Pied Piper people away from their beloved steaks, cheese and avocados. :smiley:

#28

As I said before, we will leave it to @richard and @carl to decide.

(Chris Bair) #29

It’s significantly more complicated and complete than that. Just for the sake of clarity: the big difference between a typical/traditional meal replacement or BPC and these complete meal replacements like Aussielent, Keto Chow, KetoOne, Keto Fuel, Ketolent and others is: These are designed to have all of the nutrients necessary. Meaning: all the vitamins, all the minerals, all the ELECTROLYTES. They’re designed to be able to be used to completely replace however much food a user cares to without ill effect or deficiencies.

You could replace breakfast with BPC as long as you make up for what you miss in your other meals. Replace 2 meals a day with something like that and you’ve got a lot of nutritional debt to deal with. Replace 3 meals a day and you’re courting disaster.

The insulogenic aspects of whey are generally observed in a sort of vaccuum - seeing what happens if you consume ONLY whey protein. Only this mix also contains 1/3 of your daily fat, in addition to the protein. I haven’t been able to find any studies on the impact of fat on insulin response to protein so it’s all conjecture. In my own N=1 experiment on blood glucose response to drinking Keto Chow, there was no significant change over 6+ hours and 2 meals. Anyway, it’s an interesting discussion that I’m eager to continue with @richard - he also has some serious reservations about whey protein and has done his own N=1 experiments.

#30

Slimfast also claims to have all the nutrients you need too!

Many people eat OMAD plus a BPC. I would go as far as saying it is part of the norm of keto, I see it so often! Replacing three meals a day with BPC is called a fat fast!

(Derek I. Batting) #31

Since I’ve started doing 16/8 fasts here and there (it’s getting easier! Yay!), I’ll often break it with Keto Chow and prepare something a little more hearty a bit later. That makes it easy because I know exactly how much fat and how many calories I’m getting consistently every time. That’s a plus in my book. :thumbsup:

#32

I’m a data person. Opinions are ok, but data is always better. So, I am going to post a survey in this forum. Granted, not everyone will answer, and there can be skew…but, better than nothing at this point.

(Derek I. Batting) #33

Survey about what?

(Chris Bair) #34

About whether Dr. Noakes can continue to ignore the whims of the HPCSA?

#35

Im curious to see average usage of meal replacement in this community. So, I created a poll. I’m a curious type of gal, or perhaps others would call it being a nerd perhaps? :grinning:

(Chris Bair) #36

It’ll be low - most people aren’t even aware it’s an option or have prejudices (many warranted) based on experience with slimfast and the like.

EDIT: I see you generalized it to shakes, powders, bars, etc… - indeed, this will be interesting!

(G. Andrew Duthie) #38

Given that the Site Feedback category isn’t really the place to debate the merits or demerits of meal replacement, I’m going to close this topic at this point. The admins have asked @richard to weigh in on the question of a new category, so not much point in continued discussion in this topic. Feel free to start another if you’d like to have more discussion on the specific point of meal replacement.

(G. Andrew Duthie) closed #39
#40

That was not necessary. We have stated our opinions but said that the decision is down to the Dudes. You have said yourself that very few people use such a product (although also that is is part of the norm - confusing!). I simply don’t think there would be enough traffic to justify another category. The decision to create a new category is not just a matter of adding one to the list. Too many categories are confusing to visitors to the forum so it is better to be selective in deciding how many and what they should be.

(Richard Morris) #41

Yes I think that a /food/replacements subcategory to talk about these eating strategies is as relevant as say Zero Carb. But bear in mind meal replacement is fringe, and it will likely stir up a lot of strong feeling by people who prefer a “just eat real food” strategy. You’ll likely have to defend your position more than some others … but personally I quite like having to defend my own positions, so as long as you’re OK to defend your position and not become defensive - I’m happy to create it.

I personally think our way out of this crisis is teaching our kids how to cook, and what goes into food, and how that affects our bodies. But there will always be people for whom that is not a way out of the maze - and a meal replacement might help them.

That’s our mission helping people reverse diabetes.

Understood. You may get that if we make a category and highlight this strategy. But y’know you can only be made to feel something if you allow people to do that to you.

LOL. Yep. As @brenda likes to say when people challenge her food “Not Dead Yet!”

Eventually the Ketogenic forums will become a reflection of the full range of ketogenic experiences and it won’t be a 2KetoDude thing at all - we’ll just be a subcategory in among podcasts. And you can expect people to talk about commercial products all the time. And people who are obviously just spamming will be sent to the naughty corner (the spam category where google can’t see them).

We will take advertising, and you’ll see adverts for things OTHER than ketofest at the top of this forum as the forum gets so big that we can’t afford to pay for it’s bandwidth. We currently pay for 150k page views a month - it’s getting 1.5 Million so expect ads sooner rather than later.

I respect that. And that is one of the reasons I don’t mind discussions of these strategies because it doesn’t mandate use of a product, but for those who can’t formulate that themselves, buying pre-made is an option.

Chris has sent me some of the pre-mix without protein or fat so I can try my glycogen depleted experiments using it and Whey/Egg White Protein/Casein/Powdered Beef protein

An Interesting sidebar: When I first learned that diabetes runs in my family, I was eating SlimFast meal replacements twice a day per doctors orders to lose weight, and I was all of a sudden unable to read computer fonts smaller than about 1/2", and had a blood test (351 mg/dl fasting glucose) and that started me on the path I am now on.

So I do have a history with meal replacements - not a good one.