My current thoughts on cholesterol

(Robin) #41

Huzzah!!! You found another unicorn!
Good for you!

#42

Hi lfod14, thank you for your reply. I intend to reduce my satured fat intake too, by half. And replace that other half with polyunsaturated fats, and also foods rich in DHA like fish (so salmon, sardines and mackarel are going to become regulars on my WOE once more) and cook with olive oil instead of lard and butter, unless I can just cook the meat in its own juice, which is better. And alternate frying eggs with boiling them. I find I can’t ignore everything I’ve read regarding cholesterol, it’s something I will be keeping a close eye on. I don’t leave things to fate if I can help it, having already gone through breastcancer. And since I’ll still be doing keto, I am still also addressing my lipoedema and lymphedema, perhaps with even better results to come and less inflammation.

(Edith) #43

So… when I was young I used to get canker sores all the time. My parents told me it was a genetic thing because they used to get canker sores, particularly when they were young. As a result, I figured canker sores were just something that I had to put up with. It was genetic, afterall. Well… going forward several years, I gave up gluten (for other reasons), and low and behold, I stopped getting canker sores as a side benefit. Turns out it was a gluten intolerance. Turns out, I didn’t have to put up with those danged mouth sores, I just had to stop eating gluten.

So, maybe in your case, yes, your mom and grandmother both have high cholesterol, but how did they eat over the years to cause that high cholesterol? What are their triglycerides to HDL ratios? Are they carrying weight in their abdominal regions? Their high cholesterol may not have the same characteristics as yours. Thanks to keto carnivore, your higher level of cholesterol may have the more healthy characteristics such as higher HDL, lower triglycerides, fluffy LDL instead of small dense LDL.

With all that being said, I don’t think the changes you want to make are bad, unless, adding those foods back into your diet result in an increase of your inflammation. IMHO, I think if your dietary additions increase inflammation and pain, that may outweigh the possible benefits of lowering your LDL.

#44

HiVirginiaEdie, I did actually try to reinstate a few nuts and veggies, but the result was joint pain, which quickly got me back on track to carnivore (I have no joint pain on carnivore).

My grandmother passed away several years ago, but from cancer, not heart disease. I never even knew she was on heart medication for high cholesterol, but my mom recently told me she was. My mom has discovered her LDL cholesterol is 5.0, and is very concerned about this. However, I had my lipids checked October 2022 (pre keto, in fact this was the same day I made my decision to switch from HC/LF to HF/LC to combat lipoedema) and they were well within normal range. I’m happy to share my cholesterol numbers with you.

You might be right that it was how they ate that led to their high cholesterol. But I too was on a HC/LF diet pre keto, I just didn’t indulge in a lot of bakery goods and sugary treats. My treats were nuts and dried fruits, some dark chocolate, and nut and fruit bars mostly. I did allow myself a shop bought pizza at the weekends though, and I was eating a lot of bread. And what was always baffling to me at the time was no matter how much bread I ate I would never put on any weight, in fact I seemed to lose weight if anything. So I began to suspect coeliac disease, also because I has been struck by breast cancer. The coeliac test result was admittedly abnormal, but not abnormal enough for my GP to feel any action was required. But anyway, 12 October 2022 I decided to start keto simultaneously giving up gluten and bread, as well as starchy vegetables. I quickly began to lose interest in the carbs from there, and transitioned to carnivore.

My mom’s current concern is how carnivore and the high intake of saturated fats will lead to an elevation in my LDL. Whether this could happen I don’t know, I suppose there is a chance I could be an LMHR, but at this point, I wouldn’t have a clue. I will be getting my lipids tested again in 6 months to a year from now. I’ll wait that long to allow my body that time to properly adapt to carnivore.

(Alec) #45

I have been carnivore 13 months and I get my lipid results this afternoon… is going to be a very interesting conversation. :joy::joy::scream:

#46

I agree with everything Virginia Edie says in the post above.

Dr Paul Mason has some great lectures on the Internet on cholesterol that are easy to listen to/watch and very informative regarding statins and cholesterol facts.

My GP tracks my cholesterol but as far as I am concerned, I am only interested in my triglyceride number, that is the only cholesterol number that is an indicator of problems (as far as I am concerned). And homocysteine is a good one to track if you are worried about heart attacks or stroke.

Raised cholesterol numbers aren’t an alarming indicator of anything except the huge amount of misinformation that the pharmaceutical lobby has disseminated to terrify people into buying their statins.

My cholesterol numbers are high but I have a high HDL and a very very low triglyceride number, so I now I am fine. When I see a new doctor they immediately focus on the total number and how dangerous it is… and I explain to them and they settle down!

I took a statin for about 3 weeks years ago and it had horrible painful effect on my body and I wouldn’t touch one again. I am fortunate, that protected me! I am concerned that the statin side effect of dementia is creating a tidal wave of problems in the future.

(Megan) #47

I can’t remember who I was listening to but they said statins, IF you haven’t had a heart attack, prolong life by a few days (or something equally as silly) and can cause all sorts of side effects. However, if you have had a heart attack they are recommended.

#48

Search the web for ApoB/A1c ratio comparing the TC/HDL-c for predicting outcomes. Measure your ApoB as well.

#49

Hi Alec, would you mind sharing your lipids with me when you have them? I just find it really helpful to read other carnivores’ experiences in how this WOE affects their lipids. As I haven’t yet myself seen how it affects mine, and just don’t really yet entirely comprehend the science around the lipid system.

(Alec) #50

@never2late All the details and lots of commentary right here… go to the bottom of the string…

https://www.ketogenicforums.com/t/carnivore-the-2nd-year/112525

Cheers
Alec

#51

I can well believe statins have awful side effects in themselves. But I’m also interested in the idea that LDL, kept too low, could also cause problems and raise all cause mortality, and thus lead to a lowering quality of life.

(Alec) #52

That is what the evidence suggests. You can absolutely have a too low LDL level: if you do, you are affecting your health in a bad way. It is not as strongly clear that very high LDL is great for you, but the evidence that it is bad for you is very weak.

#53

Hi Alec, I read your results in the other thread you linked to, and your LDL does seem very high, so I think you might be right that you could be an LMHR. I have spent the last few days, besides reading other articles and studies, on the cholesterol code, becoming more familiar with Dave Feldman’s ideas. And I am most fascinated with his experiment in manipulating his LDL which you can read more about on his blog: the cholesterol code. You’ll find all the necessary links to his work and experimentation and hypotheses on the cholesterol code. I’m sorry I can’t post you a link to the blog as I’m typing on my phone.

My LDL (tested October 2022, when I was still on a HC/LF diet) was 1.37 mmol/L. And the doctors’ reccommended level was 2.0. And I’ve suffered with a host of health problems for years, so am probably a very good example of how low LDL does not indicate good health. Now on carnivore, I have pretty much rid myself of all the inflammation and chronic constipation, and am feeling so much better. It’ll be interesting seeing what my numbers will show 6 months to a year from now, following a carnivore WOE.

Wonderful your calcium score was so low. 10 out of 100 is really good. Age is perhaps also a factor? I am 39. I do understand we can’t remain in superhero status health, as we get older. We can only do our best armed with the knowledge we have. I will be testing my calcium level too, those 6 months to a year from now.

I did have a look at my test results from October 2022, as such a lot of things were checked. It said Serum calcium 2.3 mmol/L. Calcium adjusted level 2.25 mmol/L.

#54

NevertoLate, consider getting your mom the book: Lies my Doctor Told me, by Dr. Berry. It might help explain some of what we know about health and eating. Also, check out a facebook group:The Cholesterol Code. It’s a great site that explains a lot and you can find links to many studies that are helpful.

I personally don’t concern myself about high LDL or heart disease since I’ve been eating a Keto diet for years now and my health has never been better. Cancer, I believe, is fed by sugar, so again, a very low carb diet would be one of the first things I would go to if I had cancer or was trying to prevent it. Not saying it’s the ONLY thing I would do, but would certainly start there.

#55

I’ll have a look at that book GreeneggsNham. I am familiar with the engineer, Dave Feldman’s blog the cholesterol code and his and Siobhan Huggins’ work. I too believe, from everything I’ve read now, that sugar will lead to and exacerbate cancer. As someone who went through breast cancer three years ago, it is certainly a strong incentive for me to continue my WOE though not the only one. I started a ketogenic WOE, because I was diagnosed with lipoedema, but have since learned so much, and come to understand the WOE has many other benefits and protective features.

#56

Dr. Bozworth just posted a short video on Cholesterol. Not sure if you are interested in it, but here is the link, just in case: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rymCw1ED5tk

#57

Yes, I’m interested in anything that might provide me with more knowledge/insight, thanks GreeneggsNham. I’ve bookmarked it, so can watch it later.

(Alec) #58

If you haven’t already, consider looking at Dr Malcolm Kendrick’s videos… he provides a lot of deep insights into cholesterol, statins, and CVD and makes it pretty easy to understand.

#59

Thank you Alec, I’ll have a look. I’ve just finished listening to Dr. Diamond’s presentation on LDL, lowcarb, statins, it was highly interesting and very useful information.

(Alec) #60

@never2late, the problem with going down the rabbit hole of learning that you are going down is that you can’t unlearn what you see… and you start realising the fundamental flaws in our medical systems, the horrible conflicts of interest of many of the individuals and organisations in the medical establishment, and you start getting really sceptical towards authority in general.

Depending on your personality, this can be an exhilarating place to be or a very scary place to be. But it is never dull! Be aware that not all knowledge is easy to live with!