Just ordered pizza delivery

#21

@FishChris
Oh no there was nothing to “rise” in the recipe I used. No yeast. I am not a great cook, and the reason the pizza topping was bad was because I couldnt get the pizza sauce to taste right as I made it from scratch. So I ordered one today to get that old pizza taste again - not the crust but from the sauce.

(Dirty Lazy Keto'er, Sucralose freak ;)) #22

Oh okay
Got it. We have used tomato sauce a few X’s … But I think we enjoyed it most with just pesto sauce and olive oil. Then of course we still used sun-dried tomatoes as one of the toppings :slightly_smiling_face:

#23

If y’all haven’t tried it, we really love spaghetti squash pizza crusts. Katie Lee on the Food Network has a really good recipe. We put whatever toppings we want on it, probably two tablespoons of Rao’s, cheese, and Italian sausage on my side and pepperoni on my wife’s side.

Katie Lee’s spaghetti squash pizza crust

#24

@FishChris
I love pesto and thats a great idea- also because I can buy it. And no carbs! Thx!

#25

Hi @Chantarella!
I think you’re referring to a recent post of mine which mentioned this idea of eating only the topping. I’m glad you tried and glad you liked as much as I do!
As for those onions, I have to admit that I would skew the old advertisement “a day without orange juice is like a day without sunshine” and make it instead “a day without onions is like a day without sunshine”. If keto meant no onions, I could not last on keto, it’s that simple!
That being said, you’re right that they’re carby. And yet I eat them, and I’ve been slowly but steadily losing weight the year I’ve been keto-ing. Maybe not as fast as if I were to cut them out entirely? Maybe, but I’d refer you back to the above: life isn’t worth living without onions!
Seriously, I’d humbly suggest you see the 20 carbs as an “ish” and as a rough guideline. I just don’t think there’s any WOE in the world that is really that precise. If you feel good, if you have all the appropriate signs regarding your adaptation to fat, I wouldn’t sweat it to quite such a degree. And that’s my two cents’ worth!

#26

@Annoula
Hi Annoula! Yes you were the one who mentioned eating the pizza toppings! And I agree with everything you say. I cannot live without onions and I love garlic too. I have lost 7 kilos in 3 months and am more settled in with keto now ( except for the rash) and I simply love it. Even when the rash was at its itchiest and it was torturing me, I knew I can never go back to SAD! I am so happy scratching all the way. LOL

#27

@Chantarella, we are two peas in a pod :grinning:. I feel no need to stop keto either – such a livable WOE!

Sorry about that rash (do you think it’s keto-related?) and certainly hope it disappears soon!

#28

@Annoula
Yes, it is the so-called keto rash and it makes you miserable. And as usual, dermatologists never know the causal connections for a skin disease. They usually prescribe some kind of cortisone because they don’t know and cortisone gets rid of symptoms but not the root cause of many illnesses. Only cortisone doesn’t seem to work for this. I have done a lot of research on it and they have no idea why it happens, except that it is connected to ketones in the blood.

(Bunny) #29

Not trying to avoid this delicious pizza thread but it could be your body is being flooded with too many ketones at once and your liver is literally part of your skin.

You could just wait it out until you adapt to burning fatty acids for fuel better but it is like pressing on the gas peddle in your car (accelerating up the ketones) when you restrict carbohydrates too much in the beginning, eventually you will learn you can go up to 100 grams in carbohydrates and still be ketogenic and 300 hundred grams when metabolically fit (if your not already, which may explain the keto rash?).

If you notice the Koreans I showed you in those pictures on your rash threads they all share one trait, they are all super thin and breaking out in the same rash?

What I have seen many times on the forum with couples when 1 person is doing keto and the other is not (randomly eating whatever and how much they want) that the person doing keto will jokingly test the person (ecto-meso-morph) eating limitless-amounts-of-whatever-foods with a blood ketone meter and surprisingly they are the one that is in ketosis (how do you explain that?) and the person trying to be in ketosis is not? Even if you are fat, you can be metabolically fit (you would just need a little weight lifting).

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#30

I dont know but I would assume that the thin person choses low carb foods. I know a very thin lady who says she eats what she wants- and that will be a lot less than normal people eat. And then she told me “But I love cream! I eat a lot of cream” and I had to laugh. So she eats cream but not sugars. LOL
But it is true I dont do sports and would never go to a gym. I am 67 and dont do stuff like that. Maybe i am producing ketones end not using them enough. But the thing is, although tied into the production of ketones, it seems there is another hidden factor that in combination with the ketones creates the irnflammation of the skin. Some say fungus in the intestine and others say bacteria also in the intestine.They just dont know.

#31

@Chantarella, wow, I feel for you. I didn’t really know about the rash so just read up a bit on DietDoctor. How incredibly frustrating! I certainly hope for you that you’re one of those for whom this happens only now while you’re a relative newcomer to keto. Otherwise, would you consider upping the carbs just a wee bit?

Anyhow, truly, all my sympathy!

(Bunny) #32

Your blood is probably very acidic right now and you need to buffer it with a little more carbohydrates (your loosing electrolytes too fast) and your body is trying to leech it from your bones and vital organs. Your mitochondria may not be accepting the ketones (but is producing plenty of ketones from fatty acids but not cooperating in uptake[1]) for fuel as readily as you would like it to and you may have lots of ketones floating around in your blood stream not doing much of anything but irritating your skin?

References:

[1] “…All cells with mitochondria can take ketone bodies up from the blood and reconvert them into acetyl-CoA, which can then be used as fuel in their citric acid cycles, as no other tissue can divert its oxaloacetate into the gluconeogenic pathway in the way that the liver does this. …More

[2] ”…The human liver produces up to 300 g of ketone bodies per day (Balasse and Fery, 1989), which contribute between 5–20% of total energy expenditure in fed, fasted, and starved states (Balasse et al., 1978; Cox et al., 2016). Apart from serving as energy fuels for extrahepatic tissues like brain, heart, or skeletal muscle, ketone bodies play pivotal roles as signaling mediators, drivers of protein post-translational modification (PTM), and modulators of inflammation and oxidative stress. …” …More

[3] “…In healthy humans, the body is continually making a small amount of ketones to be used by the body for energy. In times of fasting, even overnight while sleeping, the amount of ketone bodies in the blood increases. The normal pathways to create energy involve either stored carbohydrate or non-carbohydrate substances. When ample carbohydrate stores are available, the main pathway used is glycogenolysis. This involves the breakdown of glycogen stores in muscle and liver. Gluconeogenesis, the production of glucose from non-carbohydrate sources such as lactate, is often utilized as well, especially in situations involving exercise. …” …More

[4] “…Case Report #2 An 18 year-old Japanese man was started on a classic KD at a 2:1 fat to carbohydrate and protein ratio to treat intractable seizures. Other medical diagnoses include Dandy-Walker malformation (a rare congenital malformation of the cerebellum and 4th ventricle35), cerebral palsy, and intellectual disability. He was on Clobazam and Lamotrigine to treat seizures prior to initiation of the diet, and these medications remain unchanged with KD initiation. The patient was admitted to the hospital for three days to initiate the KD. Nutrition assessment done prior to admission by the RDN reflected a well-nourished male without any signs or risk factors for malnutrition, and no contraindications to initiation of the diet. The KD consisted of a Ketocal® (Nutricia North America, Gaithersburg, MD36) smoothie in the morning; eggs, fish, beef, vegetables, avocado, avocado oil, sesame oil, heavy whipping cream, and butter for lunch and dinner choices. All of his meals were pre-calculated by the RDN. The patient’s seizures ceased on day 2 of the diet while in the hospital, which coincided with moderate ketosis (evidenced by urine ketones at 80 mg/dL on day 2). He was discharged on day 3 of the diet in ketosis (urine ketones were 160 mg/dL, serum beta-hydroxybutyrate levels were 1.28 mmol/L). Approximately 9 days after diet initiation he developed a pruritic rash characteristic of PP (Figure 2). Specimens drawn included a complete blood count with differential, C-reactive protein, and a urinalysis. Lab results were unremarkable. The potential side effects of the standard antibiotic treatments were concerning, so the Ketogenic diet team discussed discontinuing the diet with the patient’s mother. The mother stated that the seizure cessation on the KD was of greater value than the discomfort of the rash, so it was decided to continue the diet. By day 14 the rash had worsened, with increased redness around the lesions. Therefore meals were modified to decrease his diet ratio to 1:1. This increased his carbohydrate total allotment from 16 gm per day to 51 gm per day. Protein intake was increased from 70 gm per day to 95 gm per day. Fat intake decreased from 173 gm per day to 146 gm per day. Despite the decrease in his KD ratio, his urine ketones remained consistently at 160 mg/dL. On day 17 the KD ratio was decreased to 0.75:1 with the addition of apple juice to each meal. To achieve this ratio his carbohydrate allotment was increased to 90 gm per day. Protein remained consistent at 95 gm/d. This resulted in decreased urine ketones of 80 mg/dL, with an occasional decrease to 40 mg/dL, and resulted in a significant improvement in pruritus and erythema the following day. …More

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#33

@Annoula
I did up the carbs a bit for 2 days-like raspberries and some LC sweets with some carbs. The rash lessened, but I also gained a kilo in that short time. What kind of tradeoff is that, eh? I seem to be the type of person who really really has to keep her carbs below 20g/day otherwise I dont lose any weight. So I might have to stick it out and hope it goes away in a few months. i dunno. Right now I am trying doxycycline which has also helped some people due to its anti-inflammatory effects and my itch has lessened a lot plus some areas look like they are more pale, but it doesnt say that this is a lasting cure. But no matter what- I am staying with this type of eating. Maybe when I become fat adapted enough I can eat an apple a day? Simply up my carbs to 30 or 50 and retain the weight loss? But until then…scratch scratch scratch…sigh.

(Bob M) #34

That’s a nice recipe. Spaghetti squash does not cause me issues, unlike zucchini, which does. I will have to try that soon.

#35

Again @Chantarella, I feel badly for you L. Fingers crossed indeed that it just resolves itself. Until then – I use coconut oil for the inflammation of rosacea and it often calms things down within a half-hour or so. Couldn’t hurt to try?

#36

No itch today. I really dont get it? WHY? And I have only eaten 9g carbs today. Must be the doxycycline I took this morning. But thx- will try anything when it returns. And I am guessing it will. Just hope not as severe.