I fell off big time

[PaulL]

Exercise enough to burn off the glycogen in your muscles (Pre, During & Post) is best.

I’m curious: What would be the reason for wanting to burn of glycogen? In that form, it is stored either in muscle (where it is trapped) or in the liver (from which it can be released and shared). Is it doing anything in that form?

[PaulL]

then the body (the liver, right?) is making it from the body’s stores - and in no way is that ‘all bad’ from the standpoint of what most of us are after here.

But I don’t see how it’s good, either. Unless the liver is enlarged from storing too much glycogen, it will have to make glucose from the pool of available amino acids, which would increase the need for protein. And I don’t see any particular advantage to that.

[CaptainKirk]

Paul,
So, your body is stressed, and it is turning off/down your ketone production.
Releasing Glucose. it has NOWHERE to go (especially if you are sedentary).

So, the idea comes from Tim Ferris, who noticed that if he did a ton of squats before and after a dessert, it would totally blunt the Glucose spike from the dessert.

What I have noticed is that MOTION in general helps to nullify the impact of a stress response, at least on my Glucose. And if I get to it soon enough (hence PRE and DURING), then the muscles become a Glucose SINK. So you get the RELEASE and the ability to utilize or absorb. Without RESORTING to Liver Storage, stopping Ketones, beginning a NEGATIVE IMPACT.

This is why I am playing with this… And why I went back to wearing a CGM.
This along with Cylcing on/off Metformin. I can use a SINGLE DOSE (or a 2 in one day), and get a decreased glucose affect for DAYS now… Previously this took weeks of strict diet, or about 5 days of diet plus exercise, and TRE.

So, the reason is to create room for the Glucose. So the liver doesn’t have to deal with it.

[CaptainKirk]

My gut feeling is that it isn’t “so bad,” though, because where is that sugar coming from?

In my case… Excessive Gluconeogenesis! And once I trigger it, I have a tough time turning it off. My BS starts to run high all the time, I get sleep disruption. Imagine being “Stressed” for many days in a row. It’s the best description.

Yes, you have “Energy”, but at a pretty huge cost. It truly decimates my Ketones. Today I was at 0.2 and 0.3 despite carnivore, and cutting calories a bit.

And my cycle becomes: Stress -> Poor Sleep -> STRESS … (Repeat). [Both increase IR]
So, whatever I can do to deal with the impact of the stress (burn it off), seems to also help with sleep…

Now, being Human… I can have all the cause and effect backwards or sideways.
But this is a journey of discovery…

Dr. Boz had a Gal who could not lose weight despite VERY Low caloric input.
It turned out to be the 1-2hrs (either gaming, or watching an INTENSE series).
Her glucose would go sky high, and she would fight the hunger, but the insulin result would kill her energy and her ketones…

That’s what caused me to start testing more…

[OldDoug]

Now, being Human… I can have all the cause and effect backwards or sideways.
But this is a journey of discovery…

KIrk, sounds like you’ve found how best to proceed for yourself, and what makes you feel the best - and that really applies to all of us. If it really is excessive gluconeogenesis, then that’s pretty wild. And if there are preventable behaviors that trigger it, then there you go.

In the context of eating very low carbs, I was thinking that “more glucose being made” means lactate and glycerol (obtained by the body from breaking down stored fat) are being used up, and most of us are after that fat breakdown to begin with.

[CaptainKirk]

I was thinking that “more glucose being made” means lactate and glycerol (obtained by the body from breaking down stored fat) are being used up,

Interesting, I have had quite a few Very High Lactic Acid Readings. Sometimes 3x Normal.
The human body is so complex… We squeeze on one system, and other systems activate.

The downside to a strong gluconeogenesis pathway is that a large carnivore meal is enough food to keep your glucose high, and high enough Glucose tends to knock down my ketones, and I start losing the KETO benefits (anti-inflammation being one of them).

The downside is that the GNC converts Amino Acids (Proteins) into Glucose. It’s the last stage in Cancer Patients. Muscle Wasting, in order to feed their cancer. Happens in old age as well, which is why how much muscle you keep is such a strong indicator of lifespan.

[whiplash55]

It’s inevitable, we all do it at some point. At least I do. What happens next is more important for you, if you just go back into the routine and stick with it, you’ll be fine. But if you dwell on it, that makes it worse. Just pretend it never happened, and forgive yourself, it’s not a huge deal, you know what to do because you’ve already proven it works.
Keep calm and Keto on, as Carl and Richard would say.
This is why they came up with the theme.

[jpmenezes]

As the Two Keto Dudes would say, “keep calm and keto on”