(Ben) #6

Sadly, if the adorable nurse practitioner is telling everyone to cheat, the trial will conclude that keto is not sustainable.

(Susanna) #7

I have maligned my nurse practitioner, making it sound like his one direction was to cheat. No of course not. Obviously cheating should be kept to a minimum! It only came up in context of my worrying about a trip abroad I was taking and staying on diet. He was just trying to reassure me. And he has the antidote to every difficulty, which is an excellent sense of humor. I was writing originally to get tips on getting back on wagon. (I cheat about twice a month in the form of half a toasted English muffin, 14 grams carbs. I did more on my trip.) As I said, his encouragement and kindness is what has kept me on the diet. And they may conclude that keto is unsustainable in any case because the biggest problem is not cheating but getting people to sign onto diet. People (who are already dealing with a lot) say, no carb, no sugar? No way. Give me a pill instead. And these are people who have a deadly illness for which the keto diet is showing promise as a treatment! (In addition to chemo and radiation). So part of the success of keto dieting, is the support system you have. And mine is excellent.

(Jane Reed) #8

Let me get this straight. You’re willing to feed a BRAIN TUMOR the food it loves to grow on because dear Josh says you should cheat? And just who is cheating who here? I’m flabbergasted.

Why not spend some time in the Boring Keto thread and the Recipes thread? I don’t know how a person could think keto food is humdrum.

Your health is way more important than a muffin, whose pleasure is gone the moment you take the last bite. Please, please hitch up your big girl pants and get back on the wagon. Find some keto foods you really like and overeat them, if necessary, to keep you straight.

By the way, I’ve found Matt’s Matthead pizza dough to be a tasty flat bread substitute.

(What The Fast?!) #9

If you feel the need to cheat, you can make keto versions of lots of foods. There’s a 90 second bread that tastes just like an english muffin, for example. Also, instead of “cheating,” try indulging in keto-friendly foods. If you can make it a month or so without artificial sweeteners or cheating, you’ll stop craving the cheats. (I know it sounds crazy, but it’s true!)

(Susanna) #10

Why are you being so mean? I have never been on a forum. I’m sorry I apparently chose the wrong one. What you are flabbergasted by is what we call human or being flawed. Have you ever smoked? You have never known a moment when logic doesn’t win? Docs say I may have to be on diet for rest of my life. Half an english muffin isn’t going to kill me (according to science) but no bread for the rest of my life may, so to speak.

(Susanna) #11

Thank you, Andrea. Good tip!

(What The Fast?!) #12

I know that keto seems extreme at first, but I promise you - there are SOOO many delicious foods that you get to eat - guilt-free! :smiley: Check out the these threads:

A lot of people (who are not keto) will say “I could never stick to that,” but if you focus on what you CAN have instead of what you CAN’T, it’s a whole lot easier! And if there’s a food you miss that you just can’t live without, there’s a way to make it work with keto.

Remember, this is your health and your life. Josh may say a cheat now and then is okay (and I’m sure he means well), but there’s a heck of a lot of people who would encourage you to stay the course instead. If you take an “all or nothing” approach now, you’ll find that cheating isn’t a temptation down the line. :smiley: Good luck!

(Siobhan) #13

I would also echo here that you may want to try “cheating” with keto substitutes. Keto can be boring if you arent sure what to do with it, but once you explore and find some gems it is very exciting and yummy.

For example Diet Doctor’s recipe for english muffins (I use it for eggs benedict), or keto ice cream, or deviled eggs, or caveman chili, or cinnamon bun pancakes, pork rind waffles, plenty of curry recipes like saag paneer and butter chicken, sides like cauliflower rice and mashed cauliflower with plenty of cream butter and salt, meatballs, fathead pizza, keto mug cake, mocha cheesecake brownies…
There is plenty out there! Believe me!
Not to mention simple stuff like aged cheese, good quality sausage, etc

Check out the recipes section of this forum, especially the section called #boringketo

Yes, life without bread may seem hard, but if you give it a few months with no cheating it does get easier.
I do not recommend cheating exactly because of what you described - it makes keto harder and leads to a slippery slope that is difficult to get out of. A little here… a little there… but a little kicks cravings into high gear and turns into a lot.
I would much rather eat a keto english muffin and clams breaded in almond flour abd fried rather than risk a binge that would put my life in jeopardy.

You of course have to make that decision for yourself, but if your biggest issue is the feeling of keto being boring then there are plenty of recipes to try and help combat that.

And no… you dont have to eat avocados.

I would also recommend checking out the cancer section of the forum to hear from people having the same struggle as you. It can be very scary having to face giving up something you love for the sake of your health… but I have found most things I gave up had keto replacements that make me feel good instead of sick.

Whatever you choose to do I wish you the best luck on your journey!

(Susanna) #14

Thanks everyone. This is SO helpful. Thanks. Will get cooking!

(G. Andrew Duthie) #15

If we’re talking about something as serious as an inoperable brain tumor, cheating should be kept to zero. Obviously, you’re a grown-up individual, and you can make your own choices about what’s important to you. But IMO, this goes well beyond “cheating”. Eating carbs is a life-threatening choice in your case. I would recommend you consider talking to a competent mental health professional. They are likely to be a better resource than an internet forum, and may be better able to help you deal with the challenges of your situation.

I don’t interpret that as mean, so much as astonished. You have stated that you have an inoperable tumor that thrives on sugar, and you are choosing to feed it. That is a self-destructive choice, and it is hard to comprehend. Hence my suggestion that you may have some deeper issues to work on that aren’t going to be solved by a forum post.

By all means, KF is a great place to find recipes, tips, and similar support. But you need to be putting your life and health ahead of a desire for carbs. And no one here can make that happen for you.

(Duncan Kerridge) #16

When the numbers are small it doesn’t sound like a lot of carbs, what’s 28g? It’s neither here nor there. But knowing your condition would you drink a cup of coffee with seven teaspoons of sugar in it? Because that’s what 28g is equivalent to. 4g of carbs is a teaspoon of sugar.

(Jane Reed) #17

My purpose was to be tough, not mean, and I regret it came off that way. A serious condition like yours shouldn’t be trifled with and it seemed that’s what was happening.

If course I have ruined my own good intentions many times. Sympathy never helped me stay right, but some people respond to it better than a kick in the pants, which gets my attention. I apologise.

(Meeping up the Science!) #18

It’s unfortunate the nurse practitioner gave you permission to cheat. I feel bad for the participants who dropped out - probably because they were encouraged to cheat, too. That’s terrible.

Two years ago when I received my Celiac diagnosis, I was told to eat all the pizza and cake I wanted. I have a serious eating disorder, and this was very flawed advice. I almost completely relapsed entirely.

Keto is hard if someone has an eating disorder or an addiction. Most people can regulate what they consume without these things, though. I turn down food all the time. I throw away food all the time if I can’t eat it. I struggle very badly if I don’t eat the same thing every day. Other people need variety and must cook. work with your strengths! It’s very possible to have great variety on keto, actually, and never eat the same thing twice.

Note, I am not saying you have an eating disorder. :slight_smile: Just that if it’s very difficult to follow any food regimen even in the face of cancer, it might be good to explore why this might be the case. It’s a hard situation all around though, and I am so sorry you have to deal with this.

(What The Fast?!) #19

Wait, what?! Who told you this? Why did they say to gluten if you couldn’t tolerate it?!

(Karen Parrott) #20

Here’s the link to the cancer forum on this site. The support there will be more individualized to your case.

Best wishes for you.

(Susanna) #21

Thanks, Karen. I checked it out and you are right. More appropriate. Thanks, S

(Susanna) #22

The participants who dropped out did so because they found the diet too hard which is underrstandable given that they are also dealing with cancer. I barely made it through the keto flu phase (which lasted about 2 months for me) which was brutal given everything else. My keto diet was followed down to grams details by medical staff. In fact at first, hospital made my food (which was as you can imagine). Anyway someone helpfully suggested I follow a keto cancer forum and she was of course right.


Good for you for sticking it out!

I have three close friends/family with cancer and one with dementia whom I encourage to try keto – but you are right, for many people, this is a confusing and difficult change in already stressful lives. I feel fortunate that for me, it was very easy. (I also cannot eat wheat, so maybe that made it easier for me to avoid temptation.)

And cooking those keto treats absolutely helps!! I made tiramisu muffins last night that were soooo good.

Hope you find the support you need here, this really is a great forum full of good people.

(Meeping up the Science!) #24

In order to get diagnosed with Celiac, they have to do an endoscopy, and so you have to eat gluten for a few weeks before. They only diagnose it if there’s visible intestinal damage, so that’s actually standard. Even though all my antibody tests for gluten and wheat are sky high, that’s still the technical way to diagnose it.

I wound up getting one for unrelated reasons, and I still got my diagnosis just from trace gluten.

(Meeping up the Science!) #25

I understand, as I have worked with some folks in your position. My problem isn’t with you but with the staff. If staff is telling people to cheat, we’ve found that it makes an already hard situation all the more difficult. It’s a hard situation all around. I mean, I’ve helped little kids with epilepsy and other neurological disorders stick to the diet, as well as a few cancer patients, too. Most of the studies I’ve seen provide behavioral support for exactly that reason (my job).

The good news, is that it’s both good for curing cancer, as well as neurological trouble. It helps tremendously with everything brain-related. Good luck with your recovery, Susanna :slight_smile: