Calling on the Wise Ones! Help!

(KM) #21

How well are you sleeping? Menopause interfered horribly with my sleep. And I’m starting to notice that when I’ve gotten a crap night sleep I just don’t feel confident in the morning when I step on the scale, and 4 times out of 5, I’m Right, my weight is up a pound or two rather than down. I don’t know what it is about sleep that helps with weight maintenance or loss, but I’d swear it’s true.

(Alec) #22

I may be a bit different (fairly large bloke, exercises a lot!), but my issue has been eating enough… on carnivore I have been struggling to eat enough. I find carni food very satiating… if I have a decent sized steak (let’s say 1lb or 500g), I am struggling to eat anything else for many hours. If I have 2 meals like this in a day, that is 1kg of steak, and that is only 2700 cals (not that I count or anything, but it’s a useful rough guide), and for me that’s not enough: basal need around 2000 ish, plus I can easily do 1000cals of running a day. It’s not a million miles out, but my experience is my hormones tend to get me to undereat than overeat. I still have plenty of bodyfat for my body to recognise it may want to shed, so that may explain it.

#23

Yeah, it’s different when one has a higher energy need… My body tends to want 2000 kcal at least (of course it’s not that simple but I have been tracking since ages and this number was noticeable) - and I don’t lose fat eating that much, no matter my woe. (While I did, it was easy to lose fat.)

Carnivore is interesting. I tend to get satiated quickly - but I get hungry quickly. And again. And again. And again. Carnivore (or very close to it) is the only woe where I possibly can’t last for 3 hour after eating. It can be 1 hour, easily and I am hungry again. Stupid small meals but I can usually avoid them if I am determined. If not, I try to eat again very soon, no matter what, fortunately(?) I never needed hunger or appetite to eat.

Carnivore food can be very satiating (not very fatty pork) or not satiating (chicken, very fatty dairy, added fat), of course these are my personal satiating/not satiating items, people have them very differently from each other though red meat is usually good at satiation. If I need my mealsize to be bigger than what I have automatically, I can focus on less satiating items - or add a few nice bites containing 1000 kcal in the end. Maybe not always. While eating enough never was my problem, more like the opposite, carnivore is different from all the other ways of eating I ever tried. It must be the lack of hunger inducing plant carbs. Keto wasn’t anything like carnivore. It was normal, like before.
But I still overeat if my timing is off or I eat a lot of stuff besides meat. But if I don’t make those mistakes, it’s great. Eating a lot would be easy because fat doesn’t seem to satiate me much (beyond the little I need, like 100-120g. I add 100g more, the same satiation. I always keep myself from adding much more so IDK what would happen with 300g fat. I probably would feel satisfied and perfectly satiated. I probably couldn’t do it for long term but I don’t need much food to begin with.)

#24

Thank you! Going to educate myself a bit and give it a go. Will report back!

#25

That’s a good point! Think I need to be more careful/conscious of how much I’m eating instead of macros only.

(Michael) #26

Your metabolic rate is paramount, and depends on your average caloric intake as well, so knowing how many calories in addition to carb intake can set your metabolic rate baseline. In some cases people need to eat more to increase their RMR before they can then lose weight. Take tracking seriously to get an honest assessment of where you are at as well.

Separately, carnivore rocks mostly due to protein satiation and insulin suppression, but I can gain weight on OMAD on carnivore if I eat 4000 kcal a day, and I can do that easily enough, even though I weigh 64.5 kg.

#27

Dr Berry is full of contradictory information. Yes he’ll hold his hands up and say he got it wrong, but the wrong information has already been delivered to millions online many times.

(Marianne) #28

When I got into trouble, I had stopped tracking or counting macros. I think if you do both for a time, you will be in the optimal range for good health and weight loss. I do try to keep the total carbs as low under 20 as I can. I think I need to get back to tracking and staying within my macro guidelines.

(John Bradshaw) #29

@Hketo What specific examples can you give where Dr Berry has contradicted himself, since you say he “is full of contradictory information”? Please supply the hyperlinks to the contradictory information so we can all see it, rather than just assert it is so.

#30

He has thousands of videos. Many where he goes back on his old knowledge admitting he originally had it wrong!

#31

Are you tracking what you eat? Or eating intuitively? If not, track. Can’t troubleshoot if you don’t know what’s going in the tank. When your hormones screw you, so can your hunger/satiety signal, don’t trust untrustworthy things to guide you.

If you’re not losing, your body doesn’t need to lose, because you’re giving it no reason too. Most people don’t do that intentionally. I though I was eating at a pretty decent deficit for a while when I was stalled forever, until I had my metabolism measured, and not only was I not at a deficit, I was eating WAY over that. yet I wasn’t eating much at all for somebody with my activity levels, my metabolism was just crap. Once I got a hold of that it started to self correct.

(John Bradshaw) #32

@Hketo Since there are “thousands of videos” and “Dr Berry is full of contradictory information” can you please give a couple of specific examples so we can understand his contradictions more fully. Thx.

(Allie) #33

Would you prefer he stuck to his original claims despite acquiring new info / knowledge? We are all in a constant stage of progression, all learning as we go and as we learn, our beliefs (unless we are closed minded!) will progress and change with us.

(Peter - Don't Fear the Fat ) #34

I actually find it reassuring that he updates info based on new studies and research.
Though I totally get what you mean.
If you see an older vid and base your diet etc on that outdated one … you may or may not see the new one

(Allie) #35

A good argument for making sure you seek out the most recent info.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #36

Bear in mind, everyone, that the research into the ketogenic diet and related matters is growing, and we are learning new things all the time. Some science is truly settled, while other ideas get overturned. (Then, of course, there are the bogus ideas that are in place for non-scientific reasons.)

For example, I well remember a video by Dr. Ron Rosedale on how we should eat a minimal amount of protein, so as to avoid activating mTOR, because too much mTOR would shorten our lives. That was a good understanding of what we knew at the time, but in subsequent years, the picture has been refined, and now it’s clear that we need much more protein than Dr. Rosedale was recommending in that lecture, and that mTOR plays a role in our longevity. It’s the balance of mTOR and autophagy (and other processes) that is essential to keeping our body functioning in good health for as long as possible.

There’s also what people hear, as opposed to what the lecturer said. I clearly remember a couple of videos by Dr. Phinney that I watched back in 2016-17, in which I remember him referring to 100-125 g/day of carbohydrate as “low-carb” and “ketogenic.” He told me he never said that, but that’s what I remember, lol! In any case, as I got into this way of eating, it became clear that while I can eat a fair amount of carbohydrate and still be in ketosis, I am much more comfortable if I eat minimal carbohydrate.

(Allie) #37

Like gluconeogenesis and protein intake which is still an ongoing dogma for many.

(Christine G) #38

Have you ever considered light, water and magnetism (grounding)? If not, consider checking out Sarah Kleiner, Jack Kruse or Sara Pugh. Circadian and circannual rhythms may need to be considered to get your body back into alignment. Diet works best when these things are considered.

Basically you want to see sunrise, UVA rise and sunset, with naked eyes (no contacts or sunglasses) and as much skin as possible to turn the clocks on in your body. There are apps for this, let me know if you would like suggestions.

Another consideration is blue light toxicity - how much blue light are you exposed to during the day and after sunset? Jack Kruse recently posted a study on his Patreon showing blue light alone causes blood sugar rises, without food consumption.

Also, if your sleep is right, the clocks in your body will send signals to dump the weight. if your sleep is not good, the body can’t do its job.

There is way more to this, but at the base level the light is the key.

Also, when I don’t eat carbs, I can’t sleep, not sure why, but each time I try it, I crash my sleep and weight loss. When I sleep, the weight comes off effortlessly. For me, sleep is the key, diet is lower on the list.

I love keto and recommend it, and can do it sometimes, but based on my age (mid 50s), it crashes my system if I do it too long.

This is not to say when eating carbs they can be any processed junk or sugar you can get your hands on, that will trash any system regardless. There are plenty of unprocessed carbs available for your location and season that will send the right signals to your body clocks of where and when you are on the planet.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #39

This is interesting, because my experience is the opposite. I sleep better and longer, the less carbohydrate I eat.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #40

That sounds fascinating. Can you post the author and title? I could look it up in PubMed and give it a read.